Something to read to the police when stopped

Published On April 12, 2012 | By CopBlock | Articles

I composed this document, and am having it laminated and will keep it in my vehicle. Upon being stopped, my plan is to hand this the the officer. Can anyone provide me with some feed back on it..first, are my points correct? Second, what do you think the officer’s reaction will be?

To the Law Enforcement Officer who has stopped this vehicle, please read if you like, I will read this aloud for your dash camera.

I am assuming you are stopping my vehicle for an alleged traffic violation. I will be providing a current driver’s license, registration and proof of insurance upon your request. I will answer no questions regarding the traffic violation that may violate my Fifth Amendment rights. (example: do you know how fast you were going?). State your allegation and I will sign the citation agreeing to appear in court at the designated time and place.

Please do not ask my passengers for identification. They have no reason to identify themselves.

To protect my Fifth Amendment rights, I will not answer questions about the origin or destination of my trip.

To protect my Fifth Amendment rights, I will not answer questions regarding my passengers or the contents of my vehicle.

To protect my Fourth and Fifth Amendment rights, I give no express or implied consent to search any part of my vehicle.

Please do not take this personally, I am simply insuring that my rights are protected.

Thank you for your cooperation.

– RLM

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  • Andy

    You spelled “ensuring” wrong. Other than that. Spot on.

  • Knowaymr

    Love it…how about a shadow image in the background or a little graphic of you bending over mooning with a doughnut covering the neither realm.

  • Andy

    I think it’s great but, you will probably end getting pulled over by some crew cut wanna be soldier who is avid subscriber to soldier of fortune magazine. Who would love
    to pull you from the car and beat you within an inch of your life because you know your rights. Cops hate that.

  • antiass

    You and your passengers are going to jail a cop considers not answering questions and or not submitting to request as reasonable suspicion. And after all is said and done the charge will be resisting arrest/non-violent. Its best to play stupid and let him do whatever they want to, short of a BJ, and gladly accept your ticket and go.

  • Alex

    Just a couple suggestions.

    To Law Enforcement Officer –
    delete: “who has stopped this vehicle,” – you may find yourself detained while not moving or while on foot.

    If you would like a permanent record of our interaction, I will read this aloud for your dash camera, as I am recording our interaction (be sure you are).

    1. I will be providing you with legal identification or a current driver’s license, registration and proof of insurance upon your request.

    2. I will answer no questions that may violate my Fifth Amendment rights. (example: “do you know how fast you were going?”).

    3. State your allegation and I will sign the citation agreeing to appear in court at the designated time and place.

    4. Please do not ask my passengers for identification. They have no reason to identify themselves.

    5. To protect my Fifth Amendment rights, I will not answer questions about the origin or destination of my trip.

    6. To protect my Fifth Amendment rights, I will not answer questions regarding my passengers or the contents of my vehicle.

    7. To protect my Fourth and Fifth Amendment rights, I give no express or implied consent to search any part of my person or vehicle.

    Please do not take this personally, I am simply insuring that my legal and civil rights are protected.

    Thank you for your cooperation, officer.

  • dac

    Its good. I especially like the part about “please do not take this personally”, I’m sure a lot of them would.

  • jpcfourth

    Great idea! I’ve been thinking of having business cards with amendments printed on them, to hand to officers during any interaction..

  • jpcfourth

    @antiass reasonable suspicion is not probable cause. It’s not best to do what he says, if you inform the officer that you do not tolerate the violation of your rights, and he does while on record (assuming you’re filiming the interaction) you will automatically win during the contest.

  • Lori

    If you were in Albuquerque they would f***ing shoot you for “contempt of cop.”

  • me

    I’d say take out the line where you state that you know he’s probably pulling you over for an alleged traffic violation.

  • Grant

    It’s great but I would change ONE thing-I wouldn’t mention the 4th and 5th amendments to the U.S. Constituiton: I would mention whichever parts of your STATE Constitution cover the same ground. Trust me it will make a world of difference

  • Angry

    It’s a great read, but I don’t believe it would be very practical for all situations, maybe if the cop starts skirting the law it might slap him down a peg, but right off the bat I wouldn’t use it. Personally I just give them them “my papers” if I’m legally obligated and just sit it out without answering questions.

  • Steve

    WRT asking passengers for ID, in many states the passenger would be required to identify himself.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stop_and_identify_statutes

  • wilsmith

    Why does everyone have to act like they have something to hide? That’s when you get in to some kind of confrontation, giving people a reason to be suspicious of something.

    Here’s how my last stop went:

    “Hey sir, you know you were speeding back there? ”

    “Yes sir, just lost track of my speed there. Here’s my info.”

    “And is this address current? Just heading to work?”

    “No actually, it’s now xyz, I just moved here last week. and yeah, on the way to work. Not even in a hurry, just got too fast going down the hill there.”

    “Thank you, I’ll be back in a couple of minutes. Hang tight”

    ….

    “Here’s the citation. I’ll need you to sign right here. You know, you were pretty respectful, you should come contest this and we’ll have it removed.”

    “Thanks, will do.”

    Two weeks later, it was all dropped.

    I could have had two bodies in the trunk and a bag of cocaine under my seat and the guy wouldn’t have ever even been suspicious.

    and I’ve had about a dozen other stops that ended similarly or more frequently with a, “just slow it down next time.”

    If you’re just polite and treat the guys with respect instead of treating them like they’re out to get you, you’ll be alright. Especially in some lame-o traffic stop. If you come out guns blazing with this list of canned responses you’re going to just piss the officer off for being a condescending jerk and they’ll be sure to write you the biggest ticket they can.

  • Anna

    looks good! Just one minor correction – I think you mean “ensure” not “insure.” They kind of mean the same thing but insure is almost exclusively used to imply some kind of financial insurance (like medical insurance or getting your car insured).

    Other than that, thanks for this! I’m definitely planning on using it (or a similar version) in my car.

  • certain

    Angry is correct. Why escalate things right out of the gate. This at best would turn a warning into a ticket, and at worst could well end up as Andy says in the first comment. You know how mad some of these freaking psychos get if you don’t respect their self-perceived authority. Just record everything and don’t answer any questions.

  • t.

    Since you ask…..

    If you were to hand that to me when I stop you, no offense, but I’d laugh. While this is certainly better, it’s a lot like the nutter sovereign citizen crap. It will almost certainly result in you getting more citations.

    I know @TennPigs the lawyer will disagree, but I think the absolute silence, never talk to the police thing is stupid. In most encounters brief conversation / explanations can eliminate suspicions. The silence and uncooperative nature of this strategy only lends itself to more suspicion.

    But honestly, those of us that really know our jobs will just snicker at you if you hand to them.

    Good luck though.

  • Lurker

    Sounds like a good plan to get a bunch of tickets. You know what would get you out of almost all tickets? Being nice.

  • Chris

    Yea I would laugh in the face, rip it up, take every one out of the vehicle, tear the car apart and give you every citation I could think of because you want to act like an asshole.

  • Jay

    Chris says:
    April 13, 2012 at 5:35 am

    Yea I would laugh in the face, rip it up, take every one out of the vehicle, tear the car apart and give you every citation I could think of because you want to act like an asshole.

    sounds like the asshole has already spoken.

  • Speezo

    Chris says:
    April 13, 2012 at 5:35 am

    Yea I would laugh in the face, rip it up, take every one out of the vehicle, tear the car apart and give you every citation I could think of because you want to act like an asshole.

    (I’m forced to pay the pensions of idiots like that)

    Lurker says:
    April 13, 2012 at 1:47 am

    Sounds like a good plan to get a bunch of tickets. You know what would get you out of almost all tickets? Being nice.

    (No, actually that does not work. One almost fool proof way to avoid traffic tickets is to not drive though.)

    t. says:
    April 13, 2012 at 1:04 am

    Since you ask…..

    If you were to hand that to me when I stop you, no offense, but I’d laugh. While this is certainly better, it’s a lot like the nutter sovereign citizen crap. It will almost certainly result in you getting more citations.

    I know @TennPigs the lawyer will disagree, but I think the absolute silence, never talk to the police thing is stupid. In most encounters brief conversation / explanations can eliminate suspicions. The silence and uncooperative nature of this strategy only lends itself to more suspicion.

    But honestly, those of us that really know our jobs will just snicker at you if you hand to them.

    Good luck though.

    (I like to fuck with cops. If I got time I like to make em suspicious and waste their time. If they want to waste their time then let em. Back when the DNC came to town I would walk with my hands up as a protest to the almost militarized nature of the situation)

    All I would suggest is that you keep conversation to a minimum. Take your ticket and bounce. Don’t give them an excuse to assault you because as the other two have said they like any green light to fuck with people who stand up for themselves. And like the others said that card could be the trigger for some fuck head to go off. The intellectual boredom of giving out traffic citations must make their head ache and I understand the craving for stimulation but cops behave much differently than I do when I am bored i.e. I don’t find somebody to assault when I am bored.

  • Speezo

    @Chris

    Cops (allegedly) are supposed to uphold the law. The Constitution is the original law of America. Maybe you should have paid attention during civics but upholding the Constitution should be the main imperative of governmental employees. Soldiers give an oath to defend the constitution as does the President. Apparently beat cops have much different imperatives though?

  • Jtown

    It’s sad the number of people telling you not to do this because it’ll make things worse- clearly you don’t understand the concept of needing to exercise your rights, or that giving them up is NEVER in your best interest. It is ALWAYS in the cop’s interest, NEVER in yours. They are trained, all cops, just like interrogators, to get you to incriminate yourself, to give up as many rights as possible, so that their job is easier and they have more leeway to do whatever they want. Don’t let anyone tell you otherwise- they are TRAINED for this. Specifically because otherwise your rights protect you too well for them to do their job, which is to make enough money in fines and enough arrests to keep all the funding they already have and more. God forbid they be effective, and crime rates go down, and the need for police go down, right?

    If you decline to exercise your rights because you think giving them up is in any way “better,” I feel sorry for you.

    If your exercise your rights despite the possible irrational anger the cop will feel and act on, you’re doing it right- you’re a brave patriot and the rest of us should be thanking you.

  • jethro

    One of my clients is an attorney and this is what he has printed on the back of his business card:

    ‘Officer, I mean no disrespect, but my lawyer has instructed me not to talk about my case nor about anything else. On his advice, I hereby invoke my right to remain silent. I do not consent to any search of my person, my vehicle nor my personal effects. I do not waive any of my legal rights. I request that my attorney (name and number) be notified and allowed to be present if any identification confrontations, tests or examinations are conducted in my case. If I am under arrest, I invoke my Miranda rights and demand an opportunity to consult with my attorney before questioning. I do not consent to any impoundment of my property, and I request a reasonable opportunity to secure same. If I am not under arrest, I want to leave. If I am free to leave, please tell me immediately so that I may go about my business.’

    I believe that knowing your rights and the bullet points above is a better angle than handing over a card. Simply saying as little as possible, except to exert your rights is always the best road. Cops are going to be dicks, no matter their job. That’s just who they are. No sense in giving them positive reinforcement.

  • underoath

    As a cop, I don’t mind if you read that at all. I have no problem with people who know and exercise their rights. I’m not going to treat you any differently than anyone else and its not going to be a deal breaker between a warning and a citation.

    The only issue I have is that you are telling the cop not to speak with your passengers. If the passenger doesn’t want to talk with me, that’s fine, but you wont be the one making that decision.

  • blacknationalsparty

    “I am a law-abiding member of the black nationals party, I am unarmed and in possession of no illegal contraband, I am not on probation or parole. I will furnish identification if I am the subject of an official investigation into criminal activity.I do not consent to a search of my vehicle or person, I am aware of my rights under the US constitituion and I will not surrender them by force, threat or coercion by any law enforcement officer or rogue agent of the state. I am now exercising my right to remain silent”

  • Allen

    Speezo –

    The constitution isn’t the first laws of the U.S, Its the bill of rights, the original 10 amendments. The constitution was the framework of our fathers who was outlining what they wanted in a free society. It was the building block to the bill of rights, BILL OF RIGHTS, our first laws.

    Whatever your beef with LE, on the street every officer has to interpret law, and apply it fairly. Under our 4th amendment, last evening a Police Chief with 26 years of service, a husband and father of two was shot and killed while executing a search warrant. He was to retire in 8 days, but still did his job which is to support and defend the bill of rights and all other amendments. While most people in the private sector would be taking it easy the last days before retirement, this Police Chief choose to do the job he was sworn to do.

  • cobaco

    you might want to add the following as a header:

    “rights are like muscles, they get weak when not excersized”

  • Common Sense

    @chris…. Cops like you are the reason people pull ak’s and blow LEO’s brains out all over the side of the highway. Keep up the tough guy routine Billy bad ass! One day you will really run into a bad motherfucker and then you’ll be up shit creek when he blasts you right in the face. Cops like you are why people generally dislike cops. Keep it up, it’s only going to come back on you eventually and bite you in your ignorant ass. Good luck dip shit, don’t get shot!

  • Chris Mallory

    At least the resident thugs are honest about being at war with the citizens. After all, why else would they punish a citizen who stands up for his rights?

    The news this morning was filled with several cop deaths. It brought a smile to my face.

  • Carlos

    I would think…twice…I mean, three[3] times before showing that to a cop during a traffic stop.

    Cops are generally prejudiced against everyone who is not a cop and, if you were stopped, there is a high possibility that you would get a ticket anyway [remember, State REVENUES and, cops are the collectors].

    Furthermore, if the cop is having a…”bad day” or, if he just wants to be an asshole to you because he’s assuming that you want to play smart-ass to him with your hand-out rights, then he can make-up another things, that you supposedly “did” and make your life miserable.

    Thus, the best course of action would be to show him the papers he’s demanding from you for him to see [license, car registration and proof of insurance] and…keep your MOUTH SHUT. period.

    No one ever got dragged in onto unthinkable problems with the police by keeping his/her mouth shut.

    Carlos

  • marty

    How about citing some REAL law? Suggest you Google “Right to Travel”

    This Citizen-traveler is *NOT* operating a “MOTOR VEHICLE” as legally defined under 18 USC 31, (quoting) “The term ‘motor vehicle’ means every description or other contrivance propelled or drawn by mechanical power and used for COMMERCIAL purposes on the highways in the transportation of passengers and property, or property and cargo.”

    This Citizen-traveler is *NOT* a motor-vehicle “OPERATOR” as defined by state & federal law and is therefore, NOT required to possess an “Operator’s” License or “Driver’s” License, i.e. “…a permit, granted by an appropriate governmental body, generally for consideration, to a person, firm, or corporation, to pursue some occupation or to carry on some business which is subject to regulation under the police power.” Rosenblatt vs. California State Board of Pharmacy, 158 P.2d 199, 203. “Driver — One employed in conducting a coach, carriage, wagon, or other vehicle…” Bovier’s Law Dictionary, 1914 ed., p.940.

    Further detainment of this traveler (or his property) is a direct VIOLATION of 42 USC 1983, Deprivation of Civil Rights (a.k.a. “Biven’s acts”) and other deprivations of DUE PROCESS.
    Should you continue in this action, you can, and will be held *PERSONALLY LIABLE* FOR ALL DIRECT, CONSEQUENTIAL & PUNITIVE DAMAGES.

    “The use of the highways for the purpose of travel and transportation is not a mere privilege, but a common and fundamental RIGHT of which the public and the individual cannot be rightfully deprived.” Chicago Motor Coach vs. Chicago, 169 NE 22; Ligare vs. Chicago, 28 NE 934; Boon vs. Clark, 214 SSW 607; 25 Am.Jur. (1st) Highways Sect.163.

    “The Right of the Citizen to travel upon the public highways and to transport his property thereon, either by horse drawn carriage or by automobile, is not a mere privilege which a city can prohibit or permit at will, but a common RIGHT which he has under the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.” Thompson vs. Smith, 154 SE 579.

    “Where rights secured by the Constitution are involved, there can be no rule making or legislation which would abrogate them.” Miranda vs. Arizona, 384 US 436, 491.

    “The claim and exercise of a constitutional Right cannot be converted into a crime.” Miller vs. U.S., 230 F. 486, 489.

  • Angry

    @Our Cop Posters,

    Some of your last comments have been very disturbing. You openly admit to giving more citations just to get back at someone who pisses you off? That sounds like corruption to some of us, that is using your position for personal gain at the expense of the ones you serve.

    Do as you will, but if you ever wonder why your profession is universally despised (as do all cops at some point) just think back to your treatment of the citizens as an answer to that perplexing question.

  • Jaded

    I like what marty says…

    And I think once you admit to be holding a “license” you put yourself under a jurisdiction where such a notice could make your boss (the pig) quite angry and he might decide to discipline you (beat you up).

    I have seen fee schedules where you put them on notice that they’ll have to pay you money for every minute you are detained and more if arrested and so on. Since it’s your rights being violated you get to create the price. Say $1,000,000.00 if placed in handcuffs. But.. If you don’t know what your doing I’d go the “yes sir, no sir” route.

  • Carlos

    @ Angry:

    Did you know that a Cop can handcuff you and arrest you for…WHICHEVER reason he/she wants to? Just for “contempt of cop”, or for not “following his/her commands” when he/she tells you to do so.
    It’s UP TO the JUDGE or the D.A. [prosecutor] to determine if your arrest was either illegal or not. But, by the time this happens, you may have already spent hours or days in a CELL…right?

    That’s why many people become NON-confrontational when it comes to dealing with cops and just do as the cops tell them to do. The police have ALWAYS the upper hand and, because there are too many ordinances and laws designed to work on their favor, they just can say that you were breaking [...#name of the law goes here...#] and they had to arrest you.

    One of those laws/ordinances to which they resort the most to justify landing people into a cell is: “DISORDERLY CONDUCT”. This one is so vague that you only have to raise your voice when dealing with them or make some gestures and…poof!

    As I said, it’s extremely difficult to deal with somebody when that “somebody” has the power and the law on his favor.

    It’s not like disagreeing with your parents and getting angry at them and raising your voice. With your parents, nothing happens. With cops, the line drawn between “contempt of cop” is so blurry and you don’t know when you’ve crossed it, and they can use it against you even when you could get out-of-jail easily but…it’ll cost you money [a lawyer], time, having to spend some time in a cell, days lost at work, etc.

    Every time I have to go out to just…work at our workplace, I beg God for not having to cross paths with cops that day because, you don’t have a crystal ball to foresee the future and know if that encounter with a cop is going to end up well, EVEN if you haven’t done “nothing wrong” [as they say]…

    Carlos

  • Snowy

    It sounds pretentious as hell, and it makes you look like you’re itching for a fight. At least wait until the officer has stated a request for something you’re not willing to do before you hand it over.

  • t.

    Marty: Please drive past me all crazy so I can stop you. Cause then I just get to arrest you straight away. Then I get to search your car (even under Gant vs Arizona). And you get to go to jail, you’ll almost certainly resist the booking procedure so you’ll have to stay longer. Eventually you’ll get out and file all your goofy legal briefs. Then I’ll get to watch as the judge throws it all out because it’s nonsense. Hmm, maybe I’ll sell some popcorn to supplement mytaxes paid salary. It’ll be like the circus has come to town.

    If you haven’t figured it out yet, that crap doesn’t work. The people who are telling you to do it (or you are paying to tell you to do it) eventually all end up in jail – maybe you will see some there when you go

  • Rob

    Small suggestions. Part 1 is good. Part 2 is good for the most part. part 3; is fine but most law enforcment agencies have to do that anyways. It’s part of normal policies dealing with traffic stops. Part 4; bad idea. In most cases there are lagit reasons why passengers are asked to show their ID. Plus look at it for a diffent point of view. How made would you be is someone raped and murdered a close friend, girl/boyfriend, or family member. Police didn’t ask for their ID because they where a passenger and they got away. Part 5 is petty. Most cases if the answer is “from my house” or “going to Wal-mart” it’s not going to hurt you to answer and they are more likely to ticket you for lack of cooperation. Part 6 is really the same. Pus 5 and 6 aren’t covered by the 5th amendment. aswering those questions don’t fall in the catigory of “No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime”. Stating you destination or how you know someone isn’t answering for a crime. Part 7 is pointless because officers have to follow that anyways. If they don’t the case gets thrown out and all evidence found can’t be used. Plus exceptions do exist. If the vehicle smells like pot, you can be searched, reasonable / probable cause exsists. Also pat downs or “Terry Frisks” are allowed and are for checking to see if a person has weapons on them, which is backed by numerous case laws. Oh, almost forgot. For part 2, “do you know how fast you were going?” not answering that isn’t backed by the 5th amendment either. Speeding isn’t a capital or infamous crime. Not saying to not use the “rights card”, just be sure you know how it applies. If you don’t you can get in more trouble than just a simple speeding ticket or busted tail light ticket.

  • Common Sense

    @Marty

    Please show me one real legal citation (a real case) where the “right to travel” worked and lead to an acquittal or dismissal.

    I’m sure that sovereign freeman mind of yours has loads of real examples including offense, court jurisdiction and citations, just pick out a good one.

  • Lurker

    Marty loves the sovereign citizen nonsense.

  • t.

    Lurker: marty is definitely rockin’ the crazy. But I have to admit, I love the sovereign nutters. So much fun.

  • Common Sense

    The flag has a frindge !!!

  • Chris

    @Common Sense

    I don’t why your getting so upset, I’m just exercising my First Amendment right, it’s the same bullshit you hippies cry about on this website. Stop Bitching

  • Common Sense

    ha ha ha, its not bitching, asking for some facts to prove someone’s claim.

    and yes, the sovreign/freemen ideas are mostly…well, comical.

  • Speezo

    @Allen

    Yeah, my mistake. Thanks for correcting me to make my argument stronger.

    I agree with part of your statement that police are supposed to apply the law fairly but in practice that doesn’t always happen. Just as guys on wall street may feel incentive to cheat cops do too. They aren’t superhumans but merely humans with the same fallibility as the criminals they interact with.

    But they aren’t supposed to “interpret” law as they are part of the executive branch of government. That is one of the core tenets of our system. Unfortunately, we yield to them the opportunity to interpret their own actions and the actions of others. It is the dutiful recording of people like CopBlock that leads to the truth and eliminates the ability of someone in the executive branch to interpret law, as they are not entitled to do.

  • Speezo

    Where are the stories about the soldier who died days before he retired?

  • Bubba

    I like it, but I would start off with, “I do not consent to this contact with you. If I am not under arrest or legally detained due to probable cause or reasonable articulable suspicion that a crime has been committed, please allow me to leave.”

    I’d also add something like “I do not wish to enter into any binding contracts with you. I assume based on prior experience however, that you will use force against me if I refuse to enter into a contract with you. I will sign any traffic tickets you present to me, but I will do so only under protest and duress. I am only signing the ticket to prevent my physical assault and caging. Courts have found that contracts that are not entered into voluntarily by both parties are null and void.”

    I have a card I carry with me that says the following, which is legally DEVASTATING regarding anything you may be tricked into saying. “Any statements I make or alleged consent I give in response to your questions, is hereby made under protest and duress, and in submission to your claim of lawful authority to force me to provide you with information.” That means anything I say to you was said because you claim legal authority to force me to speak! Brilliant.

    I would also present the card first, before you hand over your documents, and make multiple copies to actually give the officer so he can’t claim he didn’t have time to read the card or didn’t understand it. Great job!

  • Parabarbarian

    If I am stopped while driving with a dead body in my trunk or illegal chemicals in my car, you can bet I will be very polite to the nice occifer.

  • Daniel

    Consider deleting most everything and say something like, “(If applicable) I’m giving you my driver’s license, registration, and proof of insurance. I’m going to remain silent. I want a lawyer. I consent to no searches. Please honor my demands by asking me no more questions.”

  • deepelemblues

    Sounds like a good way to get yourself a three hour vacation on the side of the road while the cop and his soon-to-be-arriving buddies fuck around with you because they don’t like your attitude.

  • FormerLSPTrooper

    As a former Louisiana State Trooper I can say this WILL turn a possible warning into a ticket. BUT! I would advise you to have a 3X5 card with a statement that your throat is sore and you can’t speak. Shake your head yes or no and leave it at that. This avoids the escalation and your garner the sympathy string-if your speading wasn’t to bad. If you then feel you need to speak, hold your throat and make it sound good. It works!

  • Carlos

    @ deepelemblues:

    At least! Someone with a thinking brain.

    That’s the truth. A Cop has LEEWAY to do ANYTHING [I mean it: ANYTHING] he/she wants to and, oversight of his/her activities is almost non-existent because their buddies will back each one up with the allegation that they were…”doing their jobs”.

    When they commit to it, they know exactly how to make somebody’s life miserable if they perceive you are having some kind of…”attitude” towards them.

    in the U.S.A., they have the upper hand and we only can try to…”comply” with what they want and…hope and pray for the best.

    This is what America has become and, unfortunately, we will have to deal with this crap if we want to live here.

    Carlos

  • XIII

    I’d like to see the cops talking trash on here show some balls and identify themselves – full name, badge number, precinct. See how legitimate your positions on what you’re allowed to legally do really are without the mask of anonymity.

  • http://www.rhodeislefreemen.org sam

    I would say that I invoke my fifth amendment rights, instead of protect. In actuality you aren’t protecting the right, you are utilizing the right.

  • Carlos

    If you’ve taken the time to carefully read the all the comments posted in this thread by Cops and/or pro-Cops you will understand why many of these guys wanted [want] to become Cops.

    You only need to read their threats, their arrogance, their attitudes, it’s like they’re trying to say: “Do whatever you want, cause we still can squash you on the floor like an insignificant roach and still get away with it”…

    I now understand why many of those guys have become Cops.
    Basically because they have “CARTE BLANCHE” to do WHATEVER they want to do to whomever they want to.

    It’s not the vocation of serving the public, it’s just because being a Cop gives them the absolute POWER to ABUSE anybody and not being held accountable for it.

    What a mentality!

    Carlos

  • GrimPatriot

    @ Chris you’re a sorry excuse for a leo. Dumbasses like you you give other cops a bad rap maybe thats why you’re being killed more and more often the people wont take your bullshit forever

  • Speezo

    When cops pull you over that is a seizure of the person which is governed under the fourth amendment. I disagree that if a cop doesn’t like you that he can detain you for any amount of time he wants and the Supreme Court agrees and says that the duration of the stop must be justified by investigation or whatever. If a cop catches you speeding that does not give him authority to seize your person for indefinite amounts of time no matter how much of a jerk you are.

    This could be a nice sting set up like they do with Kopbusters. Have hidden cameras set up (check with a lawyer first!!!) and make sure to fully document your travel route, speed and all that so they can’t make shit up and then hand them the card. Watch how they react and how much they will try to fuck you over for it. If they fuck you over for it then bust out the video and sue the liars! Honestly I don’t think the majority would do much more than argue with you and a small proportion may want to drag you out and frisk you and may get violent but that is why you keep the cameras on to document the bull shit.

  • t.

    All. I now the psuedo lawyers tell you guys to “never talk to the cops.”. I’ve been doing this for a long time. If you think that this will forward cause and secure your “rights” then go ahead, give it a shot. But remember, if I encounter you (vehicle stop / street encounter / Terry stop) and I have a legimate reason to identify you, I will. As correctly stated elsewhere above, the stop can only continue as long as the investigation is continuing. If you wanna sit there and remain silent, OK. I’ll start with Aaron Abraham and work my way through Zed Zimmerman. That might take awhile. But as long as the investigation is moving forward, I’m good. More than likely though, if it a misdemeanor, I’ll arrest you and book you as John Does and let you sit there until you can be positively id’d. Either way, good luck with you little card.

    As a little note to all. Every wondered why lawyers tell you not to talk to the police? Just go to district court and watch. Those without attorneys almost always work out the same way as those with attorneys. They just come out saving a shit load of money. Bad lawyer-no Lexus.

  • Common Sense

    @Speezo

    Correct. I think the actual ‘time limit’ is subjective. I think the USSC stated it was to be ‘a reasonable duration’ which was less then 15 minutes.

  • http://nowebsite James Briam Peterson

    Bearing in mind that the ”law”is ALWAYS on THEIR side,and NEVER yours-until and unless the LEO does something to provoke a lethal confrontation,thereby placing you(or another innocent party)in imminent and otherwise unavoidable danger of suffering death or serious bodily injury as a result of said unexpected and unprovoked,close-to-medium proximity lethal attack under color of law:your safest course is to comply with the feculent communist wretch/LEO concluding the contact as quickly and safely as possible.After which-and well before your kangaroo court date-you MAY choose to file a sworn and notarized affidavit of criminal complaint with the District Attorney as well as your State Attorney General, My advice-you are only safe if you can avoid any government contact of any kind.

  • PSOSGT

    Title is wrong. Should be, “how to make sure you get a ticket”

  • FTP

    Look at all the butthurt pigs in this thread. Eat shit and bark at the moon cocksuckers.

  • Jason

    This comment section really shows just how little Leo’s care about our rights. This is the reason I’ve decided not to care about their rights or laws any longer. Theses buffoons have gone wild and I won’t be a victim. I carry my gun in my car at all times now, and the first cop that violates my rights is going to get it, right in the face.

  • Carlos

    Thanks a lot, “T”, PSOSGT, Lurker, and all the other BADGES who have contributed to this thread, for letting us know who’s behind that mask and what kind of people police officers are in America.

    A cop, in America, is the kind of person who loves and enjoy being feared, who likes to see civilians shaking on their boots upon your presence, who enjoy seeing people bending to your power.

    Thanks for opening our eyes and realizing that you are no longer to “protect and serve” the public but to harass and abuse people who don’t shake like a leave at your feet.

    You are cops only because you like civilians to pay tribute and homage to you and not to question your actions.

    At least, all this time what I’ve been thinking that you REALLY are has proven me right.

    Thanks.

    Carlos

  • t.

    Carlos: Huh? I give you guys honest and real advice. The never talk to the police is shitty advice that floods this site. That tactic leads to your own delays and possibly more arrests. I’ve tried to explain before, if I have one party telling me something happened, and it appears that something happened, and I try to talk with you about it, and you hand this stupid ass card and say nothing, who am I supposed to believe? Your own silence damns you. Now who’s fault is that? Oh, yours.

    You want a little respect, give some. Or play the silly roll the window down an inch and hand me a card. Let will work well.

    Admittedly some of my comments of late have been a little harsher than normal, but when you guys embrace the violent posters and refuse to see that there might be another side, sometimes I’m not so nice.

  • Carlos

    @ “T”:

    Why would you “arrest” me for a misdemeanor such as speeding over the posted speed limit just because I refuse to talk to you?

    It’s my right not to talk to you..UNLESS…you caught me red-handed or you ran a scan of my license plates and turned out to be the car I was driving is either stolen or involved somehow in a crime.

    I’m handing over you my Driver’s License [and I.D.], my car registration and my proof of insurance for you to write up a ticket so, your demand of me to engage on a “friendly” conversation with you, is beyond me to understand it.

    Do you care to explain?

    Carlos

  • Daniel

    The reason these cops don’t identify themselves is because they are the types who violate the Constitution. Their admissions here could be used against them in a civil rights action. Most cops are cowards.

  • Lurker

    @carlos-

    I said you’d probably have better luck by just being nice rather than trying some kind of game with the cops.

  • Common Sense

    Actually the police cannot, in most situations, make public comments and include their place of emplyment. The police do not have the same 1st Amendment privilege as others.

    An officer can be termed or disciplined for public comments whereas you cannot, in most cases. There was a recent case in LA I think. I also remember years ago when a MA cop was termed for smoking off duty. He was reported, termed, appealed and lost.

  • Carlos

    @ Lurker:

    One thing is being polite. My parents have always taught me that “politeness costs nothing and gains everything” so, I guess I wouldn’t need lessons on what politeness is or means.
    I always try to give back what I receive.

    Now, being courteous and polite doesn’t equal to talk too much if you do not have the need to do so.

    At work, some people start gossiping about somebody. By the time the the word of mouth has reached 50 people, it’s badly been distorted and it’s not related in any way to what was said originally by whomever started gossiping.

    You are being stopped by a Cop for going 50 m.p.h. on a 40 m.p.h. zone. The Cop requests you Driver’s License [an I.D.], car registration and proof of car insurance. You handle those over to him. Why the heck should we both start a “Q & A” session for just a minor offense? Go ahead and write up and give me the darn ticket and let me go my way to keep minding my own business.

    That’s why some people get in trouble. They try to go beyond their responsibility and start taking about what is not being asked or required. In the end, your word may end up completely DISTORTED and, at worst, can incriminate you for something you never did nor intended to do.

    That’s why on this particular one, I tend to agree with fellows Copblockers and keep my mouth shut at a traffic stop.

    Even if you committed a crime, is unwise to talk about it to a cop without a LAWYER being present. Your words may end up DISTORTED or MANIPULATED.

    About showing a cop a handout with “10 commandments of Rights”, during a traffic stop, I think I made it clear in other post on this same thread. when I’m being stopped on the highway, what I want is to get the darn ticket and get it over with. Trying to wrestle with a Badge with an attitude is going to delay me because he’ll behave like an asshole just to show me that he’s the one who RUNS THE SHOW.

    Carlos

    Carlos

  • Lurker

    @Carlos-

    I guess if you are happy getting a ticket every time you are pulled over, your plan makes sense. The majority of people that are pulled over end up getting warnings, at least in my experience. Nobody is saying you have to kiss the officer’s butt, but being nice goes a long way when you are in a situation where the officer’s discretion could mean a few hundred dollars. If he starts asking questions you can always say you don’t want to answer them. I think that “rights card” would start the stop on a negative note.

  • PSOSGT

    I think what you all are missing is THE POINT.. There is a difference in envoking your rights, and being a dick about it. Both 100% legal and I really don’t care which way you go. But I know that I write about 1 ticket for every 5 cars I stop. And the ones that get tickets tend to be the fastest, and rudest people. If you sincerely had your head up your ass and admit it, chances are I’ll let you off with a warning. If you pulled out your script and read it to me, chances are I would be back in 5 minutes, with your citation.

  • Carlos

    Have you guys ever heard about: “Miranda rights” ?

    If you haven’t, I’ll quote an extract for you:

    “You have the right to remain SILENT, and that ANYTHING YOU SAY CAN AND WILL BE USED AGAINST YOU in court; you have the right to consult with an attorney and TO HAVE THAT ATTORNEY PRESENT DURING QUESTIONING”…

    ———————————————————————–

    You now know why you should keep your mouth shut during police questioning even if it was just a…traffic stop?

    Carlos

  • PSOSGT

    Carlos, there’s a difference between reading a script, and simply stating that “i’d prefer not to answer that.”

    Bottom line folk, most cops stop cars looking for dope, drunks, suspended drivers, people with warrants or people up to no good. If you aren’t in 1 of those 5 categories you’ve got a pretty good chance of getting let go with a warning. Especially at night. The last thing a night shifter wants to do is get up at 10AM after working all night to go to a 15 minute court hearing on a ticket.

    Whether you admit, lie or stand mute about how fast you were going, your still most likely to be found responsible for speeding if you fight the ticket. Honesty and Integrity in people is something cops don’t run into often. I give out more breaks to people who are honest about how fast they were going than to people who lie and give me the standard 5 over line. I had a gentleman a few years ago I stopped for 22 over. He flat out told me that he had his head up his ass and had to be doing at least 20 over. He went on his way with no ticket. If he had lied, or simply read the “rights listed above” He would’ve gotten a ticket.

    NOTE: This is in my area, and is common in my state. This doesn’t apply to traffic cops, or state police.

    But it’s your choice… you do what you want. You get more bee’s with honey than vinagar. keep that in mind.

  • Speezo

    I want to support not talking to the cops in any situation for those naive enough to believe it can be of any benefit. Consider a man who was possibly in the wrong and he knows it. The more he speaks to a cop then the more ammunition the state has to use against him in court. He is then bound to that original statement if trial comes up.

    Consider then that after consenting to talk to the police that the police “misremember” what he said and put words in the mouth of the defendant. Then he has to call the cop a liar. Juries are a subsection of the populace. That said, there will be some idiots who think cops never lie and will dislike you calling a cop a liar, even if he is one.

    Then also, why would someone guilty of a crime just admit it unless they really want the penalty? There is no benefit at all to admitting guilt. Cops may lie to induce a confession but it is never to the defendant’s benefit unless you consider a sure guilty verdict to their benefit.

    I personally have been exonerated multiple times for cases. I didn’t admit guilt and put the burden on the state to prove it. Over time statements changed in regards to the case which worked to my favor but I was never bound to any statement and my statement never changed and I didn’t have to fight the words of a cop. Why? Because I didn’t give a damn statement. Trust me, it is in your best interest 100% of the time to not comply with anything, guilty or not. Cops are actually not allowed to speak on your behalf at trial because that is deemed hearsay but they damn sure can try to incriminate you.

    DON”T HELP THE STATE TO FUCK YOU OVER!!! DON”T TALK TO COPS!!!

    My advice to criminals is not be stupid. When toting contraband don’t violate any simple laws and play it cool if stopped. Don’t give him an excuse to think twice about you. The phrase “I didn’t know I was (insert whatever)” just makes you out to be dumb, which is better than making him think you are involved in other criminality. Take your ticket and bounce. Cops don’t want to spend an hour grilling every speeder anyway so just make believe you are insignificant and don’t espouse suspicion. And if ya can’t do that then I suggest you keep your nose clean and leave that stuff to someone with more intelligence or tell your ma you are an idiot in advance so she won’t be surprised when you get caught up.

  • XIII

    @Common Sense

    “Common Sense says:
    April 16, 2012 at 10:29 pm
    Actually the police cannot, in most situations, make public comments and include their place of emplyment. The police do not have the same 1st Amendment privilege as others.

    An officer can be termed or disciplined for public comments whereas you cannot, in most cases. There was a recent case in LA I think. I also remember years ago when a MA cop was termed for smoking off duty. He was reported, termed, appealed and lost.”

    Then maybe they should shut their fucking mouths about how they’re going to violate people’s rights? I’d think some of the things said here are worthy of punishment / removal. A blatant disregard of rights, to the point of mocking people who are informed and serious about not being subject to illegal searches is disgusting.

  • wageslave1

    Sounds to me most of the cop pricks on this site sound like complete assholes who could give a shit less about protect and serve and more about harrass and annoy. Or maybe to corrupt and kill. Or maybe beat and cite. Whatever it is, its sure the fuck not about serving your communtity! (except citations)

  • Common Sense

    You really need to understand when and where Miranda enters police contact. Based on your statement, you think anytime a cops appeals, you get read your rights. And hearsay? You need to read what that is too. A cop can tell the court what you said.

  • Carlos

    @Common:

    —————————————————————–
    “It’s better to be king of your silence than slave of your words.”
    ——————————————————————

    When have you gotten in trouble for not saying a word and…how many times you’ve gotten in trouble for saying something you shouldn’t have said?

    A Cop, pulls me over for doing 50 m.p.h. on 40 m.p.h zone, I stop the car, wait for him to approach. He taps on my window, and asks: “Do you know why I’m pulling you over?”…If I say, “I know why”, I’m admitting guilt; if say “I don’t know why”, he’ll get pissed because he knows I was speeding [based on his Doppler/laser radar] and he’s thinking I trying to “pull his leg”.

    Either way, depending on his mood, I still will get a ticket.
    So, why the hurry to start a chit-chat with somebody I’m not acquainted with, whose only mission is to enforce laws, not to make friends? To get in trouble unnecessarily?
    If you like talkative people, so be it. But, I’m not the kind of talkative person with people I don’t know and, much less with people which I know that are out there at speed traps with the solely purpose to pull over drivers and giving them an infraction.

    Several years ago, my uncle [who was 61 at that time] was driving on an unknown route. He got lost. GPS receivers were almost non-existent at that time. Inadvertently, he made a U-turn where he wasn’t supposed to. He got pulled over by a State Trooper. My uncle was calm, respectful and handed over to the Trooper, his Driver’s License, vehicle registration and proof of insurance [all papers in order], and tried to explain the Trooper he was lost looking for directions.
    What did the Trooper do? He gave my uncle a ticket anyway. He did not believe my uncle’s version of the facts and, instead, told him : “tell it to the Judge”.

    So the moral of the story, not matter how polite you are and how much you talk and tell the Cop, if it’s on his mind to give you a ticket, he WILL.

    So what’s the point of opening your mouth at a traffic stop? Please, explain.

    Carlos

  • Common Sense

    That’s not the point, you can talk if you want when pulled over, I could care less. I know that cops are people, polite is answered with polite, act like a tool, get shoved some tickets. Its not a criminal interaction (at first) since to my knowledge traffic tickets are normally civil infractions. Driving is a privledge. Its your resposibility to read what traffic laws are in the areas you are driving. Can I turn right on red? U-turns, unless otherwise posted, are permitted, or maybe they are not, but you better check the AAA brochure when planning your trip.

    The issue was with Miranda and the right to remain silent. When does Miranda trigger?

    Seriously, about 80% of the commenters here have some legal knowledge but its incomplete. They read the Bill of Rights and falsely assume that’s it, that’s what the rules are. But they’re not are they? Most don’t understand that decisions come out daily on 4th, 5th, 6th Amendment issues at the state, federal level and yearly by USSC. Most don’t understand there are expections to the 4th Amendment and exceptions to obtaining a search warrant. Most don’t understand that there are times when the police don’t have to read you Miranda warnings and there are times when they do. Most watch too much TV or look at one ‘freeman’ site for legal advice. If youw ant to sit in jail, tell the judge off about the flag having a fringe.

    I have yet to read any comment by anyone holding a bar card so you might want to read some.

  • chase

    its hilarious that you guys still address mr “T” and common nonsense as though they are cops.

    they aren’t. they just pretend to be one on teh internetz.

  • Pete Malloy

    I’m inclined to agree with Chase on this one. The shit these guys talk about doing is a violation of ethics 101. A good cop knows his decision in regards to a ticket as soon as he/she hits the lights and stops a car. The driver, short of a valid or legal reason, should not influence the decision. Further, there has to be a history of enforcement on violations or the stop can be suppresed for being prejudicial. Any officer using traffic for interdiction would be aware of that. A cop isn’t going to post on here, its nothing, but a liability to do so. I think half the people on both sides are 12 year olds who are just running their mouths. It is cheap entertainment though and I need the laughs

  • Allen

    To weigh in regarding a MVS, in NH most rual PD’s run about 95% traffic and the other 5% criminal complaints. My PD has two main traffic routes which are State owned, therefore any tickets written and violations paid go to NH, not the local juridiction. Most speeding occur on these routes, with that said 90% of traffic stops are warnings. We all have our nitches, pet peeves regarding equipment failure, speed etc. even if you are traveling well above the speed limit chances are you will get a warning. Even when you give people warnings, some still treat you like dirt, complain about the stop etc. but its all about the job, good and bad. If you don’t talk, I may think your trying not to breath in my direction so I may look around plan view doctrine, so you may be there a few minutes more, I will note that in your warning or ticket. I will document. Had a stop a few years back of a jeep doing 90mph. stopped the vehicle, now if the speeder didn’t talk with me, my choice could be to arrest. NH law a motor vehicle violation is a criminal offense and if we wanted could arrest all violators, but that wouldn’t happen as we all know it would be stupid to do so. Getting back to the stop the speeder was heading to his bosses house with a hand the size of a basket ball as it was fractured from a ladder coming down on it. I made a deal with him that he either is taken to the hospital or if he wanted to continue I would ticket him, he choose to be taken. 90 in a 55 is just dangerous, I removed the danger by working with the driver, his boss drove him to the hospital. By the way he drove by the hospital enroute to his bosses work place, again I didn’t push the point as I know how pain can tunnel vision your thoughts. this is just one of hundereds of stops that have their own issues.

    I’m just saying, talk, don’t talk that’s up to you. If your stopped becuase you or your vehicle matches the description of a hit and run, or robbery, assault, abduction and you don’t want to talk, make plans to be with us for awhile.

  • Joe Backwiet

    This is something I have had for 9 years now. Mine says Mr, Police Officer here is my driver’s license, registration and proof of insurance. I will not answer any question, except yes that is my current address. I am exercising my fifth amendment rights. They will always ask you that one question. I have used it many times, because I’m not such a good driver. They usually get a chuckle out and sometimes they act a little pissed, But let me tell you it works. Have you license, registration and proof of insurance in small baggy on the sun visor. Hand it to them as soon as they approach. Just make it short and sweet. No need for details. Police 30 years ago they might stop you with a better attitude and I might tell them where I’m going and they might come by and drink a beer. But cops don’t drink and they don’t have a good time. They are not like us. They shave their heads like robots, so I don’t associate with them.

  • Mike Holecheck

    Also, I have a camera in my car at all times. If I am ever in a vehicle that isn’t mine I always have a voice activated voice recorder. If a cop stops you and he doesn’t like your attitude he can say something smart like I’ll hold you here all day and see if I can’t find something to charge you with and you got it all on tape. I had a cop had someone stopped. The driver pulled out about a quarter mile before I got there. I passed the guy. Here comes the cop. I waa half a mile ahead of him. He caught up with me within 2 miles and passed the other driver and then dumped it into his car. He said I was going 70 to catch you so you had to be going 70. He was probably going 90 mph. I got off because I had a camera and showed it in court. Some states the cops are just bastards and the worst I’ve seen is Delaware. They don’t have jails there. You go to prison. For a small state they got more cops than any place I’ve ever seen. Delaware has a load of chicken plants which means lots of blacks and mexicans.

  • Jeff Fitzhugh

    Cops today when they stoop you seem to do a lot of looking around. It used to be you could drive around with beer cans in the car. Today a beer can can mean search and then what else might they find? So the times have changed. Cops used to drink too. They used to go to the bars, but you seldom see one in bar now. It used to be when they got you you were wrong. Now not so much.

  • Bill Wilson

    I know places where there are speed traps. I mean there are no houses around approaching town there is two businesses. You have to be going 25 miles an hour for half a mile for no reason. ANother place it’s a two mile stretch you have to be going 25 miles an hour. It’s a neighborhood but the houses are not right on the road. It’s places like this they’ll write tickets once a week and they’ll probably write 30 or 40 tickets and collect a couple grand. It’s stuff like this that makes me avoid even going to town.

  • John Thomas

    Here’s the deal. Some people can be nice and some can’t. IF you can’t be nice you are better off handing the cop the card. Because that is better than a smart comment. It’s worse if the cop is a colored or mexican. Because that’s like a slap in the face. They should be in Africa and not policing anything. The thing is I avoid going to town because it takes half an hour just to get through the red lights. Then you have sheriffs and state troopers and city police to deal with. I just stay in the small towns and avoid the big towns. Places I go to you know everyone.

  • John Thomas

    Here’s the deal. Some people can be nice and some can’t. IF you can’t be nice you are better off handing the cop the card. Because that is better than a smart comment. It’s worse if the cop is a colored or mexican. Because that’s like a slap in the face. They should be in Africa and not policing anything. The thing is I avoid going to town because it takes half an hour just to get through the red lights. Then you have sheriffs and state troopers and city police to deal with. I just stay in the small towns and avoid the big towns. Places I go to you know everyone.

  • Jim

    As we all know, the police are all experts and anytime you question their authority, you’re just asking for more bull$hit. Going on the defensive as soon as you’re pulled over is not a position I would advocate. Deal with one question at a time, don’t set yourself up for more harassment. I’m not saying that you have to take $hit, or submit to searches or anything else. I’m saying that reading this to ANY cop that pulls you over for a burned out tail light is going to end badly for YOU. Remember, his supervisor had the same bad attitude toward citizens that he does, further emboldening him to be a jerk.

  • Terry Smith

    It is true it is much better to be polite. I mean a smiling face and a good attitude, but you are only required to roll down your window enough to hand the officer your paper work. This atmosphere created because today they look in your car and if they see an empty beer can then they can search. Thirty years ago they didn’t care. So having to deal with them today is different. Now when the cop asks you if this is your current address he just wants to see if your sober. After you answer that and he asks you where you are heading ang you say you don’t feel like discussing your personal business then he might get an attitude. I know years ago we would sit there roll the window down and there was one cop who made us pour our beer out, because we all knew him and as he handed out the beers for us to dump out we would be drinking them. But today cops are all shaved and the way they engage people is to invoke a confrontation. If I was a cop and someone seemed sober and I saw a half burned joint in the ashtray I would not care. If I saw an empty beer can in the back of a truck I would not care. Cops can do what they want. I say the best idea is to just stay away from them, so I only go to drink in a small town with no cops and take a back road home. Never get stopped, but let me go to the town with cops and it’s a huge risk.

    What makes it worse is the seatbelt law. They are able to stop you so much more, because maybe they didn’t see the belt. So what I do is When they stop me I pull the seatbelt on and put the shoulder strap under my arm. But the best thing is to have a van where they can’t see what you are doing, because sometimes you might need to switch drivers and a van is the only way they can’t see you and you can hife your beer cooler behind you. Because as soon as they see any sign of a cooler they think beer.

  • Glenn Payne

    I used to be a cop. Back then we didn’t have much trouble. But now they stop people for seatbelt violations. They look into cars and if they see a beer bottle they can search you. In the seventies we didn’t care if someone drank some or smoke some pot, because Cops drank and some smoked pot back then. I used to get six beers while on duty heading home and would drink a beer. Something has changed and I would not want to be a Cop today, because I would not ticket for seatbelts and if someone just got off work and wanted to drink a beer and maybe had a joint in the ashtray I would think how difficult times are and I would look the other way. I think we are heading to a police state. You don’t have freedoms anymore and you will lose them all in a few months.

  • XIII

    I just wanted to say thanks to the last two posters (Terry and Glenn). Really insightful and well-written. Terry makes a great point about cops trying to provoke people into confrontations. It’s all in the attitude – demand respect while openly mocking people and of course you’re going to get people to mouth off to you. Obviously not all cops are like this but fuck the ones who are; and you have to assume that you’ll be dealing with the dick cops every time you encounter one, or at least be prepared for one.

  • Anthony Searles

    What you need to do is put in a signed afidativ with all local law enforcement’s stating the fallowing:

    My name is __________________ I live at _____________________ my contact phone number/email is ______________________________ This is a forwarding notice to all law enforcement agencies. I reserve the right to record by either audio or video surveillance on any interaction I have with law enforcement representatives. Either at my home, in my vehicle, place of work, on public property (park,streets,sidewalks,etc). If at any point in time any law enforcement agency does not wish to be recorded they are to state so prior to contact with me as well as give reasoning why. If I find any fault in reasoning I will inform law enforcement representative that I will be continuing recording and they may reserve the right to communicate or not. Please state this notice during briefings and inform and Law enforcement representative of this notice. thank you for your time and cooperation.

    By turning in this notice (make sure you have a copy too) with a date on it. You have already given forwarding notice to Law Enforcement that you will record any interaction they have with you. So thus not needing to inform officer who pulls you over. I live in Bakersfield Ca, I have given this notice to KCSD, BPD and CHP. I record all interactions with law enforcement and have a huge pile of incriminating video. At any time an officer says you cant record him, notify him that his department has already been given notice.

  • Anthony Searles

    You also have to remember, No Gov. Agency is your friend, if you fuck with one, you fuck with them all. I am no friend of the Police nor am I a friend to this current Gov. Recently I filed a complaint against a KCSD deputy for failure to make arrest on my ex wife who I have a restraining order against. He caught her on my property in violation of stay away order, I showed him harassing txt msgs from her, she openly admitted to it. He decided he wasnt going to make an arrest. So I went to I.A. and filed complaint against him, two weeks later he came to my house threatened to do physical harm to me, I stood there shaking my head and saying “YUP” once he was done bumping his gums.

    I said well u see that pretty lil lens like thing there, that’s a camera dumb ass. I called I.A. filed another report. Then I got CPS at my doorstep questioning my metal stability because I have a security camera on my property and I must be “Paranoid”, so I jump through all there lil hoops and play all there lil games. Took 6 different mental exams because they were accusing me of cheating on them because each time I took em…. It said I was sane.

    So if your wanting to play dick, make sure your willing to go all the way… I am. Now I get regular visits from my local sheriffs office, they come out to my house daily…. Just to see how im doing, wanting to make sure im okay. (this last week alone 8 visits)

  • Nicol Moreland

    My name is Dr. Moreland, I recently sent out an e-mail asking everyone to sign the petition at change.org to bring the department of justice to Albuquerque to reform our city police department. For those of you who do not know my brother in law Christopher Michael Torres was killed by 2 undercover policemen. They said they were delivering a traffic warrant and shot him in the back 3 times at point blank range within 1.5 minutes of arriving at the house. Christopher did not deserve to die. Please help me help our city and good police officers by signing the petition at the link below – PLEASE. Christopher was only 1 of 18 fatally shot in the last 2 years. 26 have been shot. There are also many other civil rights violations that have been submitted to the DOJ

    Goto change.org to sign:

    Petition: United States Department of Justice: CONDUCT A FULL INVESTIGATION INTO ALBUQUERQUE POLICE DEPARTMENT ABUSE | Change.org

    You can also see the U-Tube video explaining the situation here in Albuquerque. My Mother in Law and Father in law are featured in the video. Dr. Steven and Renetta Torres. Please help!!

    Click Below to view video

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hisREw7Q6bY

    Please post the petition to your social media pages!! Please forward to your firends and colleagues.

    Thank you for your considering helping our effort in bringing a safer and more collaborative community together.

    Dr. Nicol Moreland
    Rio Rancho, NM

  • Allen

    @ Glenn Payne – Regarding a police state –

    The laws made are by your elected officials, not cops, I know you know that – LEO’s are required to enforce these laws from violations to major crimes. Yes it would be great to get back to those days of cops delaing with crime, but now we deal with seltbelts, dogs, families, and pretty much anything else the state wants to make a law/crime.
    To get some of these laws, some pretty wild laws off the books, it must be done by our elected officials. Are you a selectboard member, a state legislator, federel. Why don’t you run, many people on this site do have valid issues, I’m not saying all but some do.

    in 2009 the (new) tea party movement was born again, they were able to get their people into many elections and won many elections. What you want can happen but you have to work at it like everyone else. Get elected, get some of the laws taken off.

    Police Officers are only tools……. The engineer’s of making the laws are the ones that need to change.

  • cobaco

    @allen you say “police officers are only tools”

    really? and here I thought every police officer was a person with a mind of their own.

    But you put your finger on the actual point a bit earlier in your comment:
    – nowadays -> police officer = enforcement officer
    – used to be -> police officer = peace officer
    And no they are not the same, despite first-glance appearances the two are fundamentally different professions, with fundamentally differrent outlooks and approaches to every single situation they encounter.

  • Dave Nickerson

    Cops are arseholes. I hate a damn cop they spoil all the fun. Cops never stopped any revolutions. They didn’t stop the Communist take over of Russia. They didn’t stop the advancement of Communism into Easten Europe. It’s like you give one citizen the right to do what they want to another citizen. YOu give them a gun and pay them and they can develop any kind of attitude they want.

  • Jerry Bradshaw

    I question the integrity and common sense of a person when they enforce something that they feel is the rights and freedoms of someone to make their own decision like seatbelts. If they feel that a seatbelt is there for you to use if you decide, then they should not give a ticket. But what happens is you’re doing 100 in a 50 and you are not wearing a seatbelt and they forget the speeding ticket and give you a ticket for not wearing a seatbelt. The seatbelt does not affect other drivers.
    At first it was Buckle up Buckle up and then it was click it or ticket. Why didn’t they just make it a violation from the start? Did they have to ease into it, because people might raise hell about it? But I know seatbelt stops have made them untold billions and checkpoints always gets them money. They call them sobriety checkpoints and seatbelt checkpoints, but they always ask for all your paper work.
    Why not have tire checkpoints? Brake checkpoints? I mean call them what they are a way to stop people for no reason. I would rather they stop every person who leaves a bar instead of allowing them to drive around.

  • Jamie Plumber

    Police used to talk to people decent and they were respected. Today they holler and scream and of course they are doing a lot more stops with the checkpoints and the seatbelt tickets. So if they want to stop you all they have to do is say they didn’t see the seatbelt shoulder restraint. Also, since they cracked down on drinking and driving they are making more enemies. Because who knows if they are .08 or .09? The bar should have to have some device to tell them. I know I can drive better with a few beers than I can sober. My advice if you want to drink get a boat and anyone can be driving the boat. You can be passed out in the floor and your 12 year old nephew can be the boat driver. IN fact in this day and time you need a boat to have fun. You can’t take a chance going to a sporting event or drinking in the car at all, because a first time violation might mean 30 days in jail, when 30 years ago the police might have driven you home or just let you sit a while and drive. But today you can feel things are different. I imagine it’s like they have been telling us Communism is going to rear it’s head and drinking is a freedom and they don’t want you drunk. Drinking and drugs have taken their toll and people think you can’t possible stop drugs. But you let the Commies take control and you won’t be able to find drugs and if they want they’ll close the bars and alcohol consumption will fall significantly.

  • Allen

    Cobaco –

    They are tools of law, life firefighters fight fire, EMT take care of the injured. Non of these professions write law, then enforce it, right? I know your trying to test me so bet it. Tell me where and when did a LEO write a law, then pass it without legislative approval the enforce it? There may be an aurthor of a bill that was written by a LEO, but its the people who must vote to make it law.

    Don’t you agree that laws are passed be the people, for the people? Isn’t that why every state has its own constitution and why we have form of government that’s run by the people. Now there are certian laws I don’t like either, but these same people passed the laws.

  • cobaco

    @allen

    Police officers are supposed to keep the peace, i.e. to prevent/stop the use of force not perpetrate use of force themselves. The very idea of enforcement officers is totally at odds with everything that a police officer is supposed to be. Law us the tool of police officers, not the other way around.

    Furthmore they are people not tools. They, like the rest of us, have free will and are thus responsible for their own actions. Hiding behind “it’s the law” is a total copout (pun intented :).

    The fact that some one ordered you (indirectly by use of a law) to do something does not absolve you from responsibility. It instead makes both you and those that ordered you equally and fully responsible. That is, it doubles the resonsibility not halves it, or pass it on.

    We fought a world war to stop the kind of thing that the idea that ‘befehl ist befehl’ inevitably ends up bringing us. ‘the law is the law’ is nothing more or less then a rephrasing of that particular meme! It is not an acceptable justification in any way, shape or form.

    And laws are past by the people for the people? Get real, US congress has a 10-15% approval rating, quite obviously the people mostly do not approve. The system’s has been broken for a while now and has been surviving on puur bureaucratic inertia, the weels are IMO close to coming off alltogether.

  • John Renehan

    The government does nothing we want. Do we want drugs in our country? I think not. Do we have drugs? We got plenty. Do any of you think for a second they could send troops to Colombia and destroy their drug trade? Very easily. So the fact they don’t means they want drugs in the country. Do we want illegal mexicans in our country by the millions? No we don’t. But we have them. Do you believe if they were to fine companies $10,000 or anyone who hired them would solve the problem? Yes it would.

    Do we want to fight in wars all over the world that has no bearing on this country? No we don’t. But we have them all over the world. Do people think that they are fighting for our rights? Yes people think they are fighting for our country. So we don’t have a clue. Do we want speculators raising the price of fuel everytime they hear a rumor? NO we don’t, but that is exaclty what we got. Do we want we Jews brainwashing us and lying to us and taking every little racial incident and playing it up big time causing trouble? NO we don’t but that is exactly what they do. They avoid crimes they know will inflame the whites. But some black kid is shot in a gated community they scream until they charge them with crimes. Let’s face it gated communities are to keep blacks and mexicans out and it’s why they created them.

    The government knows Oklahoma, Waco and 9/11 are inside jobs. Did they arrest George Bush or have they arrested Obama even though they know he gave a fraudulent document as a birth certificate? NO but we want the truth. The government does nothing we want them to do. They get away with it, because they lie. It’s a lie that the two parties are at war. If they were the Republicans would take the birther issue and go with it. If they wanted to get rid of the other party the republicans would have taken the fact Bill CLinton screwed black prostitutes and had a child with one and ran with it, but they said nothing.

    The two party system works like this. There is always someone else to blame and when one party screws up big time the people vote for the other party. They work together. The only way to solve our problems is to elect ordinary citizens to office and they serve just one year and this will stop the bankers and corporations from controlling career politicians. Because a corporation with billions can by votes. They don’t care about the citizens and we have no control. Even though when something like war or a politicians is so corrupt the citizens should be able to vote to remove them.

  • joe Barnes

    @cobaco

    You mean the world war was not about Germany wanting to desatroy Communism ,ebfore they took over Germany like they had done Russia and Poland? So the 35 million murdered by thev Commies before WWII is insignificant? Not worth mentioning? So everythiung was fine and ten after WWII when the Commies too a lot more land and continued to murder millions more means nothing? So everything was fine and those mean ole Germans were just starting trouble? What about all the other wars? I mean Bush lied about WMD did he not? What will it take to wake people up?

  • Speezo

    @John Renehan

    Do we want drugs? Yes, actually we do. We pay billions of dollars a year to get high.

    Do you want other adults to make their own decisions though?

    And we can’t invade Colombia to stop the drug trade without violating their territorial sovereignity and possibly enraging the surrounding countries. The people make coca to survive. Millions are poor down there and if we try to take away their means of survival.. Well, I hope you can connect the dots on that one.

    And I think we learned from Vietnam and Afghanistan that we can’t win a war unless we are committed to complete devastation. I honestly wouldn’t support that because honestly I like cocaine and I don’t like killing poor people who work hard to make a living for their families.

  • spivey jean

    For all of you think that getting a statement recorded on dash cam is going to help you, think again. The cop will either have the recording erased or mysteriously lost. Then come trial time, it’ll be your word against his. Happens all the time.

  • Nck

    Like I tell all you assholes who hate cops………..A FRACKIN MILLION TO ONE one of these jerk cops helps me WAAAAAAAAAYbefore any of you “patriots” do. And for all you NON. Fox News douches…” Next time someone mugs you try calling a hippy”

    What is the fuckin point of this bullshit site anyways? To let the world know that there are some bad cops out there? Whoooa, what an eye opener! No shit Sherlock.

    I’ve been stopped probably over a dozen times in my life, only ONCE was the officer a jerk….none were friendly, but all were professional and polite. I was polite back, I got the ticket they thought I deserved and I fought the ALL, ONLY LOOSING ONCE.

    But, fuck it, why am I wasting my time, you all are probably away at your militia camps anyways……..all military, buff, gun carrying, tough talkin………..HEY!……just like a cop!!!!!!

  • Nick

    Disregard that, I suck cocks.

  • Brent

    Always carry 3 tape recorders. Always have them running when stopped. Always have one on you and one not.. so when they erase the one they find… you will win the lawsuit with the other one. Never go into your child’s school without one. You need to check your state laws, but most states state that you are allowed to tape any conversation that you are apart of without the consent of the other parties… and that includes on the phone. Only tape record you conversations with your ex’s and your children if you are personal part of the convo. These men will lie to the GALs and you will have to give it .. even though they will not ask you they just believe the men. but anyway.. don’t listen to the don’t go in there and but your husband down.. please that is all he is doing and forwarding your emails after they alter them… oh yes … so document and tape record everything.

  • Denny

    #1 Make sure you are secured with having witnesses, cell phone, recorder, etc.
    [Roll down your window just enough to communicate. LOCK YOUR DOORS!]
    ~~~~~ Remain Polite and Calm: (remember You are a good guy and the officer might be a good guy. He just needs to know he is safe. Everybody needs to be safe and NO ABUSE!)
    #2 – “Why did you pull me over?”
    #3 – “Am I free to go?”
    #4 “I object to all of this and have the right to remain silent.”
    If they ask you to do something then, “Is that a request or command?”
    Go along w/ what they say BUT state – “I OBJECT! I am in fear that your intent is to break the law to harm me.” (scam is to get your license to contract w/ you.)
    If they want you to get out of your car say, “I want my witnesses here first.”
    If asked to do anything more than give license & reg. say “Articulate facts of crime I committed because I DENY that I committed any crime.”

  • Denny

    Also know that this driver’s license is NOT required in your proper political status as one of We the People. It is a ‘federal license’ for business entities operating in commerce.
    (ALL inherent power is vested in the people.)
    Keep in mind that the reason for the stop is to ‘generate revenue’, and this IS NOT a Lawful act.
    (We teach Law, and we are not affiliated with anyone who supports unlawful acts, overthrow of the government, violence, etc.)

  • TooManyTimes

    Here is the best way to handle a traffic stop when you have people in the vehicle.

    1. Turn off the car, turn on the inside light (if at night), roll down the window 2 inches, lock the doors and put your hands on the wheel.
    2. Remain polite, calm, and always refer to the police as “officer”
    3. Never acknowledge wrongdoing. If he asks how fast you were going, or did you realize there was a yield sign, reply with “no, officer”.
    4. When she asks for you license and registration, tell them what you are doing(“Officer, I am going to get my registration from the glove box and my license from my wallet in my back pocket.”)
    5. Tell your passengers they need to tell their names if asked, but no one should consent to anything the officer asks of them, and to follow your lead.
    6. If he asks questions about you or your passengers, and you don’t want to answer, state “This is no disrespect to you officer, as I am sure you are a nice person, but I take my rights very seriously and so as a matter of practice neither I nor my passengers will answer any questions or consent to anything. Please let me know when I am free to go.”
    7. After that, let him ask away, and repeat variations of #5, with some additional “Am I free to go, officer?” He will eventually tire of it.
    8. If he writes you a ticket, sign it by passing it back and forth to him through the 2 inch gap in the window, and say thank you at the end. Then wait for the officer to leave and pull out behind them.
    9. If he asks everyone to get out of the car, have them exit on the sidewalk side and lock the door behind them. You do the same (lock the door, after rolling up the window).
    10. If he threatens to get a drug sniffing dog or something, tell him you are a law abiding citizen and he is free to do whatever the law allows, but you will not consent to a search out of principle.
    11. If he gets a dog, or breaks into your car and finds something, don’t resist, and don’t say anything else. 90% of the time you are hung by the rope you give them.

    If it goes badly, get a lawyer. I would personally not ask for monetary damages unless I incurred some, and then if I got any beyond actual damages I would donate it to a defense fund. In place of damages, insist on expunging of your record (yes, even for the traffic violation), a public apology by the officer, sensitivity, policy and constitutional training, and that he be reprimanded with a note in his personal employment file.

    Police have a very difficult job. It is dangerous and people lie to them all the time. They also are not your friends, don’t care about your personal sob story, and will not cut you a break just because you are nice to them. They understand force, and while you cannot use anything physical, you do have rights. Politely standing by your rights is your absolute best defense.

    If you get a cop with an attitude that is obviously trying to provoke you, tell him he is making you uncomfortable and you would appreciate it if he called in other officers. After that, only answer questions about who you are or respond to requests to see your license and registration and/or insurance card. Everything else is answered with #5 and a request to be allowed to leave.

    Cops are trained to be in control. Let them, to the point that they encroach on your rights. If they instruct you to do something that is a violation of your rights or the law, comply AFTER stating “yes, officer, but I am doing this under protest”.

    For the peace officers reading this, say what you want about laughing at this stuff, but if that is the case you should get a different job.

    For those who say it never works, I say you only get the country you demand. Stand by your rights, if only out of principle.

  • TooManyTimes

    Also, for recording cops: Get Bambuser for your cell phone, set it to private and auto upload. Everything you record is uploaded to a user account that you password protect. Put a password on your phone as well so that they cannot delete what might be on the phone. If recording, ALWAYS inform the officer that their image and your conversation is being recorded off site to a secure location. Tell them you have a right to record official police business in public and that your doing so will in no way impede them in the performance of their duty. There is no right to privacy for police while on duty. Only Illinois and one other state have laws against it, and they are most likely unconstitutional (are in the process of being challenged).

  • Steveo

    We cannot just revert to a lawless society, imagine the general public brandishing six shooters and shooting each other over things such as cheating at cards cattle rustling and bank robbery. Although I am most confident I would have been the fastest draw and would have been able to survive well in such a society the bottom line is we need a law man. I DONT want the job. I want the law man to not be a pussy. If your breaking the law and the lawman gets LUCKY and busts you then you man up and take your punishment.
    Im a citizen a blue collar man not a cop. I dont like cops. but I respect them. some body has to be a cop. some body has to sell shoes somebody has to sell the grocery and yes some poor weak minded bastard has to sell the crack. thats supply and demand. thats just the way it is deal with it. If you dont want to insure your car dont drive
    if you dont have a valid DL you know if you do or not dont drive
    dont drink and drive asshole my family is on the road to.
    if you have drugs or guns or on probation basically if you know what your doing is illegal and we all do or not? our moms taught us that shit dont do it. Its only illegal if your caught….. I have to be lucky everytime all the time The dumb cop well thats there job to get lucky once. in short lets start gunning law breakers down at high noon and the law breaking will stop. thats my two cents. excuse me I must return to polishing my halo and my side iron…
    best regards

  • Steveo

    Or try this when you get pulled over pee yourself and start balling like a baby…

  • Steveo

    I apologize but the entire thread to me is comical…..WWJD yep thats right even Jesus would obey the speed limit.

  • John Ray

    I think this is perfect if you are planning to become an activist fighting for this as a cause but for the general public is asking for WAY more problems for you AND your passengers. If you ARE NOT engaged in anything illegal, why not just give the required info, take the ticket and if you feel violated, fight it in court later. If your case or circumstances are legitimate, you will win. This would be, I think superior to being jerked from your car and slammed on the pavement with a trooper standing on your neck because you were uncooperative or resistant. And refusing questioning DOES indicate reasonable suspicion which DOES mean probable cause to a cop.

  • bigfrmq.c.

    An inccident occur on my way home from work pick up my son from after school.Stop by thelocal conveince stop to get some cigrattes.apond leaving the store i seen said office sitting to my left i past him we look each other in the face.And look in my rearveiw mirror and he proceed to follow me.now mind you there was a homicide early that morning in the neighborhood i travel thur to take a shortcut home.So i made a left turn signal light on and he blue lighted me.He git out his car approach my window.And i said you mind tell me what you pull me over for SIr!!!.He reply i didnt see you seat on because of the tint…Ireoly what tint sir im driving in the front not the back seat.My car has factory tint on the back passengers driver side window.So then i ask if he could quote or show me that my seatbelt has to visible to his naked eye or he has probable cause to pull me over.

  • Wounded warrior

    I stumbled across this website while researching on weather I needed to send proof of insurance if I did not get a ticket. I then felt the need to share a recent story. I was injured over seas while serving in the army. I fractured my spine in an IED blast leaving me with the ability to walk after therapy but still a lot of pain and a lot of muscle spasms. From muscles adjusting after shrapnel being removed. Before anyone uses this to say I shouldn’t be driving I have cleared both the state and the army tests to show I am well within the capable range to be back on the road. All this is background for the next part. I was driving near salina Kansas when stopped for 75 in an 60 did all the appropriate turned can lights on pulled way off the road to give him a safe area for traffic yes sir no sir sorry to have been speeding and have you have to be out in the cold. He asked me why I was speeding told him it was my wife’s car a small hybrid and not used to it and the seat is very uncomfortable and I tried to readjust myself and pushed on the gas on accident. Totally knowing I was in the wrong and. Expecting a ticket. He then proceeds to tell me that if I fight this ticket he will make my life hell and get my driving privliges taken away. Because of my injury makes it so I have to adjust myself and speed then I shouldn’t be driving. I tell him that’s not the case I will pay my ticket and it was just an accident. He says oh well than does your injury make you lie to cops then to cause you just told me it was because of your injury. I ask him why he is badgering me and explain I am not trying to mess with him and point him to my purple heart plates also say I am not asking for anything extra because of this I would just like my ticket and be on my way. He says good because you military folks get enough extra always thinking you are owed something. Now I get upset and ask him to call another officer to the scene because I have lost respect for him and would prefer to deal with another officer. He says I thought you weren’t asking for anything extra. He goes back to his car about 5 minutes later another car pulls up and the 2 officers approach my car and he asks me to step out of the car I agree he slams me to the ground yelling if you ever threaten an officer again you will regret iti just roll with it I end up with a dwi because he found an open bottle of pain killers and muscle relaxers that I was in the process of taking due to the pain that also made me stretch they had the right count of pills in them for the date they were prescribed to me I have not drank alcohol in more than 3 yrs. I have lost all respect for police at one point I wanted to become one now I see that they are a disgrace to the American way of life that my brothers and sisters are dyeing for overseas. Hopefully the cops that read this will read this will make a conscious effort to control what they can “themselves” and get back to the days where they would lead by example and be role models in their communities. They need to get away from this belief that we are all sheep and they can piss on us and laugh before it is too late. Someday even a cop might need something from a citizen and I for one would turn my back.

  • Mr_Wigglez

    I was just pulled over from an illegal stop and as the cop illegally searched me he broke something of mine so not only am I going to sue him on a civil infraction, I’m also going to contest the ticket in court and get it thrown out. Cops need to know the law before they go around trying to enforce it.

    -Wigglez

  • http://copblock.org Lisa Desorcy

    you go Common Sense @Chris: WHat a fucking dumbass! Your’e right one day he gonna run into the wrong muther fucker who is gonna blow his fucking face to bits. And cops wonder everyday why their team mates are shot to oblivion. Its cause you think your above the law and you disrespect civilians. Fuck all yall cops. Who the hell would want to be a cop except to throw around their authority cause you sure as hell ain’t makin no damn money. Corrupt cops are why there are so many innocent people in prison and jails. To coerce someone into pleading guilty is sinful and God will deal with you in his own time. Beware!!! God does not like ugly!!!

  • donna

    What is so wrong with being courteous? Every cop that has ever stopped me has been nice. My boyfriend now is an ex cop and he used to pick up passed out drunk people and give them rides home,as long as they could tell him where they lived. Why must we assume the cops are enemies? I had a cop push my car off to the side of the road for me when it was disabled. I had one officer call when my son was 16 and had some beers just to inform me, he was assuming we were good parents and would take care of the problem, he informed us that my son had been very respectful as well. I had one cop ask the passenger how much he had to drink which I thought was wrong but I didnt make a stink and the cop just said your headlight is out, fix it. Have a nice day.

  • cobaco

    @donna:

    Nothing wrong with being courteous naturally.

    As to why we must assume that cops are the enemies. Well that’s because one bad apple spoils the bunch. The thin blue line has long since made sure the spoiling happened.

    That’s why we now have ‘enforcement officers, as opposed to the ‘peace officers’ of the past.

    Are there still exceptions? Sure, there’s plenty of cops who will not abuse their power. On the other hand there are essentially none that are willing to to use their power to the abuse of their less upstanding collegues (the extremely rare ones that try soon find themselves to be ex-cops)

  • Thomas

    i would say have it but use it if a cop starts to skirt the law, because i have been stopped a few times where the cop has asked passengers for id, and they provide it but i also ask the cop why is he asking for id, and what did they do wrong, cause even in Stop and Identify states which is a few, like less than half the country, the law still requires they to have either probable cause or reasonable suspicion. i have been let off on a lot of warnings at times also, so flexing your rights is good, but knowing when to flex them is also good to know

  • Devon

    Ha! I think the better approach is the whole “catch more flies with honey” approach. Look you can read this for a police officer, but regardless of how much careful construction you go into, the fact that you are refusing from the gate to participate breeds reasonable suspicion and obviously caters to the paranoid. Illinois V Gates would laugh at this, as would most judges.
    If you want to get out of a ticket, good luck that is really up to the officer. If you want to get locked up for impeding an officers investigation or obstruction, resisting arrest etc follow your card. The fact is the case will be dismissed against you, but not before you go to jail and are forced to eat bologna sandwiches that taste like card board.

  • PD

    I am a police officer in a big city. I applaud citizens standing up for their rights. The only problem that I come across is that people only know their rights to a certain extent. This may apply to a traffic violation, but not to an investigative stop.. Say a robbery or a burglary occ’d and your car matches the description. Carlos is a perfect example, Miranda does not apply unless you have been arrested and the ofcr intends to question you about the crime. Remember, the police are in fact experts in your rights and unless you are a practicing CRIMINAL attorney (either defense or prosecution), they know them far better than you.

    It’s best to be cooperative, police do have to explain themselves after the fact regardless of what y’all hear, and our depts come down pretty hard on us. Attitude absolutely goes a long way! I don’t write tickets to normal, hard working citizens, I have better things to do. But if i stop a guy who tells me to go f#*% myself after he just blew through a red light, I may decide to write the ticket because that would lead me to believe he doesn’t regard the laws or the safety of those around him. if you tell me you blew the red cuz you just had a long day and your mom’s sick and your kids are screaming.. you’re prob not gonna get a ticket.. we’ve all been there.

    Overall, I would say this would be a poor way to start off a contact. Most cops are in fact good people, only out to help folks. (Traffic collisions are usually at the top of causes of death, so that “silly” violation you just committed has probably gotten someone killed in the past.) However, there are always some unprofessional folks in all walks of life. With that being said, if you believe the stop is taking a turn for the worst, have at it…

  • Price

    People have no respect for our officers. They sure like to bash them when they’re in the wrong but when you need them by god you want them there. I’m all for my rights but when it comes down to it’s someone just trying to beat the system. That cop that your giving that little 3×5 card to purposely piss off might be the cop that someday saves your life, family members or a friends life. Instead of trying to prove a point, why don’t you thank one of them one day.

  • tomanypigs

    If A Cop Considers A Person Being An Add Hole Enough To Beat Them Nearly To deathThen There Is A Far Greater Problem With That Cop.When A CopPulls One Over That One Is Re,Unicellular Being Detained And Anything You Say Will Be Used Against You And Signing A Citation Is Also An Admission Of Guilt Not That You Will Be In Court On A Certainly

  • blah

    How about this: Take a brief course on sign language – enough to get through a few sentences in case he calls for an interpreter – then pretend to be deaf?

  • Falsely Accused

    Cops are not your friends. They have a job to do and they will take every shortcut to achieve their objective, just as you would at your job. When they ask you a question you need to know your rights and obligations. There is a reason that “MIRANDA” won his case. Do you know your Miranda Rights?

    You have the RIGHT to remain silent.
    ANYTHING you say can and WILL be used against you in a court of law.
    You have the right to an attorney; if you cannot afford one the state will provide you with one… (what a joke).

    Remember this: ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING you say WILL BE USED AGAINST YOU; NEVER FOR YOU!!!

    Got it?

    The USA has more prisoners per capita than any society in history, including NAZI Germany. You’re next. Private prisons have agreements with states to keep cells filled. That’s how they get paid.

  • jamie

    I agree with Price. Thank you all you police officers out there who are under paid and under acknowledged for what they do for us. I am a believer in knowing my rights and acknowledging my mistakes. That can very well be done at the same time as showing respect. I am not oblivious to the fact that there are dirty cops out there and they should be held accountable, but for heavens sake, BRAVO, to our officers.

  • soapbox

    So I thought I would share one of my traffic stop stories. I was leaving a small town going home after work. I set the cruise at exactly the speed limit. I talked on the phone with my office for roughly 30min. After hanging up the phone I noticed a car following me so close I could not see the front bumper in my mirror. I did as I always do and turned off the cruise slowing down to force the person behind me to pass (4 lane road).

    After getting down to 45mph speed limit 60mph the car turned on there lights. Until now I could not tell it was a cop as She was following so close. The cop came to the window and gave the usual do you know why I pulled you over licence registration and so on. The cop informed me she clocked me doing 79 in a 60. I told her that was not possible as the cruise had been set the entire time I had been on that road. A ticket was given.

    In court the officer gets to speak first. In her statement that she under oath swore was 100% true and accurate she stated that she clocked me going 79 heading west on highway 24.

    The problem with that is that I was heading East. After she was done talking. It was my turn. I stated that she swore under oath that her statement was 100% correct. I then asked is that true? She answered yes. I then asked her If I were driving from town A to town B what direction would I be going? She looked down and said. I’m sorry I made a mistake. I finished with no further questions.

    The Judge threw the book at me and I was given max fines and court cost. I look forward to reading everyone’s comments and suggestions.

    Thank You
    Fucked over citizen

  • josh

    I think you are on the right track, but by giving over those documents you have already given up your right to remain silent. The fifth ammendment says you have the right to be secure in “your papers” as well. Once you have given those documents to the police, the already assume you are engaging in the regulatable activity of “transportation”. Please watch this video … http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B3nok7Cby28

  • josh

    a right not exercised is soon lost

  • Kelly

    I used to think cops were nice and just trying to do there job, until I moved to Chicago. I was pulled over for making an illegal uturn (FYI, I didn’t) and ended up getting 4 tickets because I opened my big mouth. In addition, they took me in, drove my car to the police station, and illegally searched it. Sure, I got all these tickets dropped, but it cost me $3,000 hiring a lawyer and court fee’s. Then I was arrested for a battery charge because I threw a drink in a bouncers face for grabbing my ass. Ending up being an off duty cop. Again, resulting in endless lawyers & court fees.

    The fact of the matter is some cops don’t give a shit about your rights. I have recently dealt with them a lot and have learned a lot. You can tell in the first minute of talking to a cop if he is pulling you over for a legit reason, or going to completely screw you over just because he can. If you suspect this is going to happen, hand him the damn card!

  • LaDarius

    Do you know that you can appeal the judgment? Even after a court case has been dismissed, you can challenge jurisdiction. Also, if that is all that was said in the cross examination, the judge made a false judgment for two reasons:
    1-There must be two witnesses in order for a statement to be proven as fact and the police was the only witness in the case and ANYTHING that happens “outside the court” and spoken of in a testimonial fashion is heresay unless there are two witnesses with the same testimony.
    2-An officer is an accuser and that is it. His word is not truth simply because he is an officer.

    The judge made a judgment based on no truthful or proven facts against you. Appeal it. The good thing about it is that you can appeal any case even if it is 10 years down the road. Good Luck and bury the bastards for fraud.

  • LaDarius

    Not dismissed, but closed.

  • chance

    You are a idiot, learn to read and write dude. Singing a citation only states that you will show up to court or pay the fine. Your signature is like being bonded out of jail on your name. Go ahead and be a dumb ass and not sign and go to jail. Man go back and read your post were you drunk while you were typing.

  • chance

    When I was a cop I did the same I wrote a lot of warnings. I would ask certain questions and read your body language to see if I needed to ask for consent to search. I was out to get drugs,weapons, and warrants I found no joy in hurting hard working people that treated me like a person. I wrote about 40 to 80 tickets and maybe 15 were pay citation. These were the people that went off on me before I even said something. Believe it or not I felt bad about how high are fines were and I knew a lot of people were living check to check. Just take my advice just me nice be real nice yes sir no sir and if you did it say so and say your sorry. If you did not do it say with all do respect I did not do what ever you are pulled over for. You can get a lot more with with sugar than vinegar. Since I have not been a cop I have been pulled over 3 times. I just was honest and treated the officer with respect. If they asked for consent to search I said I have nothing to hide go ahead and search just be careful with the camera equipment. All 3 times I was given warnings. If you want to you want to play the I know my rights game expect you will never get a warning and you will loose in traffic court.

  • chance

    You cracked me up man I needed a good laugh.

  • Chance

    People the goal is to get out of a ticket. Be nice answer questions do and say everything you can to get out of the ticket. If you play this I know my rights game you will never get a warning. If you have nothing to hide just be nice and do what he/she says. Damn are you people that fucking stupid. I have never been cited because I do what they say answer their questions and I give consent to search because I have nothing to hide. When a officer asks for consent to search and they find nothing most of the time you will get a warning and that is the goal. If you want to be a smart ass you will be treated like an asshole.

  • gatorfan

    I think you’ll likely be brought down to the station and have your car impounded. Not answering simple basic questions to allow the officer to gauge your sobriety, mental state, motives, etc…will likely give him or her probable cause to place you in custody, seek a warrant to search your vehicle and hold you while they check you for warrants.

  • gatorfan

    No you cannot “appeal anything even if it is 10 years old”. There are time limits and deadlines to filing appeals. Usually 30 days to give notice of the appeal. The cop’s testimony is evidence. You don’t need 2 witnesses. the judge can base his decision on the evidence before him and that includes the testimony of the witnesses (i.e. cop and driver). Suggestion: Next time get a lawyer.

  • missmack

    Most cops are not this way in Chicago. They are power hungry zombies and if you check youtube there are far more videos of cops abusing their power than serving and protecting. So while you may be in the minority most cops these days seem corrupt and violent.

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  • luke

    Thank them for doing their job? How about they thank us for continuing to pay them even tho they prove time and time again you can’t rely on them when you need them. The average response time nation wide is down right pittyful and most of the time when they show up the crime is done, and all that’s left to do is investigate.

  • http://fingertipaudio.net DANonamous

    Oh no, there are dfeinite, and short time limits to file appeals, anywhere from 3 days to unlimited (Felony cases are longer, traffic is at the very low end).

  • Cory Waddups

    Hey uh, I could use some advice. I currently live in indiana and in this small town people keep calling the cops on me for riding my bike/bicycle around at night. I’m 21 and I half to stay up all night because my boyfriend works the night shift. I’m doing nothing illegal and idk why I can’t seem to ride my bike while listening to my music. I’m the only one who’s usually out in this small town but still, I don’t see how it gives anyone the right to call, it’s crazy. It’s like I’m being freakin spied on or something. I know it’s not illegal to ride your bike in public just to be outdoors. Can people really lie to the officers over the phone saying (he/she was looking at my window) when I clearly never was) just to get the officers out looking for me?
    Can people do that?

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  • evan

    people are perfectly capable of policing themselves. we’re social organisms living in a society and if someone violates the accepted code of conduct the social consequences of shame, disapproval, shunning, are exactly how homo sapiens have done it since the beginning. police aren’t needed to enforce ” laws”, it’s the politicians they protect by causing the citizens of society to be scattered, labeled and divisive in order to create chaos and disorder by which the politicians are now more secure and safe in their phony positions of “service” because the “problems” of society can now be blamed on criminal elements and with following the first rule of propaganda make for enough people to be deceived to prevent society from realizing that it’s the politicians and their greed, egotism, bigotry, and lies that are the cause of societies problems. a cop is given the power of judge jury and executioner. absolute power corrupts! it always has and always will. they may start out “good” but will eventually slide down the slope of corruption, at which time they become predators. we don’t let lions tigers and bears roam freely in society, they’re dangerous. you could argue criminals are dangerous, well ANY cornered organism to include homo sapiens are dangerous when pursued or cornered. no citizen of a society should be being pursued unless they have caused harm intentionally to someone. there’s the old adage “no harm no foul”, and as for your comment about people who hate cops, hate is a learned thing we’re not born with it. so i ask you who is teaching it? the “justice” systems intolerance of victimless “crimes” appears very much the actions of those that hate. open your eyes. i know it’s hard to accept after living blindly for so long doing nothing when you could and should have done something to promote REAL Justice. it allows for a whole lot of regret, but it’s never too late. Emerson said “A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.” and Chris Barnes said “Misled minds keep on spreading confusion.”

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  • Mr j

    I was told I’m under arrest. I ” fit the description”. Then the officer drove me home said it was not me.. I was telling him that the whole time. What can I do.. or can I do anything about it? ?

  • DaGonz

    What color is the sky n your world? If people truly policed themselves.. there would be no need for cops. In the REAL WORLD, there are MARS,, morons, asshats, rejects and shitheads who cannot be part of a civilized society.

    Tell you what, Evan… when someone is assaulting you in an attempt to rob you, or rape your wife/lover/mother/significant other or molest your child, mention that he should be policing himself in order to live in a civilized society. He’ll laugh his ass off while he thrashes you, rapes and molests your loved ones.

  • Phil

    I agree that cops are necessary. That said, it, like all forms of powerful jobs, attract bullies and sociopaths(also some good peeps), and the current system is extremely broken. You say next time I’m assaulted, call a cop? I’ve done that on several occasions where I was a victim of crime, including assault by a room mate. Did they help me? Even just one time? No. The only thing a cop has ever done for me is given me a ticket and told me “Sorry, I cant do anything about that assault/theft that just happened.” Or “Sorry your parents beat you senseless, but we’re going to let them keep doing that. I encourage you to call a cop the next time something bad happens to you, because I can gaurandamntee that they won’t be able to do a thing. They will eat your taxes for income and give you plenty of tickets, though. Or kill you while they beat your ass. They are needed only as a symbol that they are there, as to keep criminals from becoming too bold.

  • phil

    No, exercising your rights is not probable cause as far as courts are concerned. It may give the cop probable cause in their own mind, however, and there is a good chance they will do everything they can to fuck with you.

  • Phil

    Yuck. What has a cop ever done for you, first hand? Can you think of one ti,e when a cop has made your day better? I bet you can’t.

  • Phil

    Maybe he’s dyslexic. You misspelled signing.

  • Phil

    Most countries dont have speed limits. They’re most likely just a tool to make $$ for the state. So maybe Heyzues would obey the speed limit, but only in America.

  • Tom L Lange

    That is a nice thought, but there ARE people that are psychopaths and sociopaths. They will not be affected by “society,” because the former doesn’t have the correct psychological reactions to societal influence, and the latter doesn’t get affected by societal influence…

    The poster above you is a bit clueless as to why/how cops can go bad, per the human condition… But ideals of “social pressure” negating the need for police is just as clueless

  • Tom L Lange

    I agree in part… Officers SHOULD be trained in legal matters, but your kid fresh out of the academy doesn’t get the appropriate training… That usually comes from some D.A. holding classes/training on that stuff…

    Problem #2: Part of the afforementioned training-is in how to get around certain qualitative requirements… Gant v. Arizona (why is it that all the “rights” cases seem to come out of Arizona? If you can take the time, use it to NOT go to that state…) corrected a ridiculous argument used by police for numerous years to simply go on evidence fishing expeditions…

    But yes, people as a whole, are far too ignorant about what their rights are. It lends itself to people resisting arrest when they shouldn’t. Which, in turn, results in police officers sometimes getting too rough…

    Not saying that education will fix everything, but smarter citizens + police with more education on the human condition, for the sake of minding their own *shortcuts* when it comes to others’ rights-will result in far-fewer convictions being overturned due to such rights violations…

    FYI, I am a defense attorney, and I DON’T want to see criminals roaming the streets… I also don’t want to see rogue cops out there overstepping their authority, or the law…

  • Rootsgal .

    They hate the TRUTH, and you stood for it. GOOD FOR YOU!
    I think you rock and I know (from experience myself) that judges let police do anything they want.
    I was the victim of a drunk driver. She happened to be 22, size 0 and blonde.
    Trooper was smitten with her from the moment he arrived. He took her bumper and had it crushed that night, because instead of telling the truth, (she yelled out, I FELL ASLEEP, 3 x’s) she told him a phantom car hit her rear bumper and took off. That is a lie, and obviously this trooper (sent off duty for 6 week unpaid by I.A.) was on a mission to protect her. She told me on the phone that he text her 3 nights later asking: “Ya wanna hang out?”
    So, if you are a young female, pretty and trashed, you can drive drunk in Connecticut, and even a Federal judge will not care, what the trooper did, to protect you.

  • Rootsgal .

    Lawyer? lol…or LIAR?
    I have found out, that I do better without counsel.
    Every time I PAY for counsel I lose. When I am pro se’, I win.
    Save your money, especially if it is a traffic violation.
    Usually, the cops never show, so you win by default.

  • Rootsgal .

    Jails are “for profit”…..read all the articles of judges caught, who were paid, to put minority teens in jail.

  • Rootsgal .

    Thank you……I agree completely.

  • Rootsgal .

    Do you think a state trooper taking a bumper away to be crushed, from the scene of a drunk driving crash, is perfectly normal? Its called “spoliation of evidence” and apparently, judges find this to be acceptable.
    Internal Affairs sent him off duty WITHOUT pay for 6 weeks. The judge did not even take their finding into account? That is surely stupid.
    Destroying the proof, of her lie, that another car hit her from behind and took off, is now gone…what if it was you?
    You’re going to tell me, you would not mind if evidence in your favor, was destroyed by the police that you called for help?
    You have zero morals……congrats, you can now apply to become a cop.

  • Do you even read case law?

    Actually, you’re wrong, PD. Under Terry v. Ohio (A 1968 Supreme Court case), “whenever a police officer accosts an individual and restricts his freedom to walk away, he has “seized” that person.” Furthermore, the Miranda decision applies to ALL court cases. Also in Miranda, custodial interrogation is defined as “questioning initiated by law enforcement officers after a person has been taken into custody or otherwise deprived of his freedom of action in any significant way”. As a traffic stop deprives the driver and all passengers therein of the freedom of movement (a type of action), any questions asked during the stop are asked in a custodial interrogation and thus the Miranda decision applies.

  • EmaLee

    so evan, if society doesnt need a judicial system, how do you determine whether or not someone is actually guilty and deserving of societal consequences? and whats your answer to people like pedophiles and psychopathic serial killers ?
    most people that commit crimes arent that concerned over social consequence, thats a big part of why they commit the crime.

    many people, with out the fear of repercussion, won’t see any problem with doing something that harms others.

    pretty glad the guy that killed my cousin is in jail, not just being shunned and turned down from jobs.

    evan, people with your viewpoint should be exempt from calling 911.

  • EmaLee

    had one give me directions last week

  • Cedric

    you wish and your an idiot…….the only good cop is a #### one and that is fact. just cause your a poser and got your ass kicked on a daily basis does not give you any authority. the country is getting wise to you and your national organizations lies. you guys ain’t shit but disgraces to the human race

  • gatorfan

    Being taken into custody and being placed under arrest are two different things. If a cop has reason to believe you’re acting suspiciously he can and will detain you until he can verify whether you have any outstanding warrants or have broken any laws. Whether you are ultimately arrested (and if you are, whether you’re ultimately found not guilty) is another matter. Personally, I’d rather just give the cop my name and driver’s license and be on my way rather than being detained for hours and possibly arrested on a trumped up charge that I then have spend my time and money to fight.