The reason the police did not arrest you for dishonor is because there was no evidence of a contract with the state. You lisence is evidence of a contract. If you had been in a motor vehicle and refused to present ID, you lisence plate is evidence of a contract and you would have been in dishonor and arrested for what ever charge they want to bring against you. That is why they have what they call a “piss of the police go to jail law” that they can use against you.

Robert Menard from Canada has a lot of good stuff on his web site. Knowing the rules of the game and asking the right questions can get you out of a lot of situations. The rules of the game is the uniform commercial code. They must follow their own rules and if you learn you can use it against them. Also there is a proceedure in court that must be used or you are in dishonor. Even though you have done nothing wrong, you are still guilty of not following porceedure therefore you are guilty. There is a great course that you can purchase called jurisdictionary that teaches courtroom proceedure. They must follow it or they are in dishonor. If you catch them in dishonor, you win.

Officer, I conditionally accept your offer to present my ID upon proof of claim that I am required to do so or required to obey your order.

Officer, I conditionaly accept your offer to move to the sidewalk(vedio tape, or whatever the order is..)upon proof of claim that I am required to do so. If you really want to hold them liable use “upon proof of claim under full commercial liability” That way if they lie to you they are in dishonor and you can file a claim against them. You cannot lie in commercial law.

You are conditionaly accepting their offer you are not refusing to present your ID or refusing to obey their orders. Under the UCC(commercial contract law) there is a difference. Honor and dishonor.

Try it, I hope it helps

If the man has a legal right to open carry, and does not have to present ID then he is just acting as a citizen. If that provokes a peace officer, then that is the officer’s problem. And yes, in some situations they will beat you down for that if you do not have a camera (or shoot you if they know you are carrying), That does not negate the fact that it takes a brave soul to test the edges of the often ego-driven power boundaries illegally drawn by officers in the line (and outside the line) of duty. Police compliance should not be solely based on threat and intimidation… it should be based on the rule of law.

Kudos to this young man for standing up for all our rights in the face of intimidation. The police are there for all of us, but to hide your head in the sand and pretend that this gives them the right to abuse and manipulate the law in an ad hoc basis for there own personal purposes is wrong