The irony of Kelly Thomas: his father was a cop

Kelly Thomas was murdered by 6 lowlife police officers last July (more here). As one would expect, they have not all been brought to justice. Only 2 officers have been charged. Manny Ramos has been charged with second degree murder, while Jay Cicinelli has been charged with involuntary manslaughter. This was only after the citizens of Fullerton protested outside the police station weekend after weekend. And of course, the fact Mr. Thomas’ father, Ron Thomas was former Sheriff’s Deputy didn’t hurt.

Keep in mind that if any other gang of 6 assholes had beaten a homeless, mentally ill man to death, they would have all been charged with murder, likely along with gang enhancements. If any other man had smashed a homeless man’s face in while saying, “You see these fists? … They are getting ready to fuck you up,” a first degree murder charge would have been a certainty.

I can also almost guarantee you that if my brother, father, or family member were murdered by police, I would not see an ounce of the justice Kelly Thomas’ family has seen, because I have no law enforcement in my family. If my father or brother had been beaten to a bloody pulp and died, I would have no credibility and would arouse no public sympathy. The public’s response would likely be, “well why did he disobey the officers?” as in the case of most victims of police murder.

This brings me to the irony of a former law enforcement officer being made to suffer the grief of having his son die at the hands of police. This is a man who, if he did his job all those years, presumably dedicated his life to, among other things, extorting people with tickets and fines. If he did his job, he spent a great deal of his time ruining peoples’ lives, causing them to lose their jobs, and breaking up their families through enforcement of drug laws. This is a man who spent his life supporting the Thin Blue Line and engaged in and supported abuse of ordinary people with a violent system that has now unfortunately come back to haunt him in the worst manner possible.

It seems that for many who previously worked in law enforcement, when tragedy strikes them (the hallowed class), it is written off as a recent development, a current trend in corruption, and a problem of badly trained young officers, whereas when they used to work in law enforcement, they did everything ethically, constitutionally, and properly. They rarely stop to consider that perhaps the system was just this bad all along, but they didn’t notice it before because they were the ones wielding power, commanding undeserved respect, and receiving the benefits and protections of the law.

Policing has always involved a monopoly on initiation of violence by a group of uniformed people who collected fines and enforced laws, whether just or not, under the guise of “protecting” others. It has been common knowledge for sometime now that forcible monopolies result in poor customer service and lack of accountability. Thus, when one group of people have an unqualified monopoly over guns, authority, and law enforcement, certain predictable results are bound to happen, and always have happened. Unjust detentions has always occurred. Racial profiling has always occurred. Marginalization and targeting of the poor and those with unfortunate skin tones has always occurred. Police have always enforced evil laws and opposed civil rights.

Qualified immunity for police officers is not a new concept that has developed only in recent years. Useless investigations by “Internal Affairs” is nothing new. Thus, the same system in which Ron Thomas proudly worked, and with which he proudly screwed civilians, is the same system he criticizes now. An interview with Ron Thomas reveals he is completely aware of the flaws in the system. Indeed, he explicitly criticizes the idea of “reasonable force” used by officers, and the manner in which this legal standard is manipulated and executed by law enforcement and the justice system.

So why does Ron Thomas have a problem with how the system deals with “reasonable force” now? His son was murdered essentially for “resisting” officers’ commands and violent subjugation. This happens to innocent people all the time. When the victims do not happen to be the son of a police officer, the public tells the victim’s family members that the victim should simply have followed commands, obeyed the law, or been more respectful in order to avoid being murdered.

One has to wonder whether Ron Thomas had a problem with it every other time a civilian’s family member was murdered in similarly senseless circumstances – for failing to hear an officer’s command, for giving an officer the finger, for defending themselves, or for being rowdy – and whether his perspective has changed in any manner since the death of his son. One has to wonder whether he, like most former police officers, still delusionally believes he was actually “protecting” people in the course of his former profession.


Georgia Sand

Georgia (George) Sand is an attorney located in sunny California. She enjoys beer, jogging, the beach, music, and chatting with her cats in her spare time.

  • I have a great deal of sympathy for Kelley Thomas, but from the moment I found out his dad was a cop, I stopped having sympathy for the father. He was part of the problem.

    One generation stands on the shoulders of the previous generation and if Ron Thomas’ generation of cops were not crooked thugs, today’s generation would not be even worse.

    This is an incremental problem that started a long time ago.

  • Pete Malloy

    The man lost his son, have a little respect. Who cares what he did for a profession, a death has still occured and a parent buried their child. This is what half of you cry out for, the violent death of law enforcement officers family so that you can feel better about the fact you failed at life. Most of the time it is about just getting someone riled up so they babble on, but in this instance I sincerely mean it when I say you people honestly disgust me.

  • merijoe

    Okay, first off – The work history of Kelly’s dad has nothing to do with the fact that Kelly was murdered by 6 lard ass cops with the attitudes (and, still, to this day) that they can do whatever they want to someone they fake say was “resisting” and in front of anyone they want to. This attitude didn’t start with Ron Thomas and it still continues.

    Second-Mr Thomas was a orange county sheriff only briefly-a few months from what I understand-hardly enough time for him to do what you accuse him of doing but enough time to understand the system-what he does currently is unknown, I think it’s teach martial arts but the man has been too busy grieving his dead son and trying to get justice for him for me to ask him.

    Third, Kelly would not have gotten 1 oz of justice either if it weren’t for the shit hitting the fan all over the world by the media, protesting every week last summer, video, pictures and hard work from everyone in the community, the trolls and various coplickers are still commenting to this day, that Kelly “had it coming to him because he was resisting”, if only he would have done what they said it wouldn’t have happened, “who cares about a dirty bum” “It’s the dad’s fault” “it’s the mom’s fault” etc, etc.

    Fourth-It’s completly shameful, borders on criminal and something a coplicker would intimate, to blame the victim or his family-for any reason, for a murder caused by 6 unfit, overfed psychopaths.

    And fifth, you are a jackass

  • Common Sense


    You won’t get any words of respect or compassion from Sands. She’s just a typical liberal, thinking that Sachs controls the world and the police do their bidding.

    She once wrote how evil a specific cop was, and that was the same cop who bought food for a child who apparently didn’t have any money, and then later that day, the cop was killed. I’m sure she got a good laugh.

    The more she rants and sides with the blockers, the more comical they become. I always laugh at her conclusions and assumptions like this one; its only because Kelly’s father was a cop, that cops are being tried, but any other article she scribbles down, cops protect cops and thus not charged.

    In her utopia, there is no crime and thus no need for the police. Sort of like star trek.

    I guess the world always needs dreamers. You just keep blogging Sands, leave the decisions to the adults.

  • merijoe

    @commonsense I like Sands for the most part this blogger is fair and compassionate, I don’t understand this particular post, I know from first hand experiance all the hard work, obstacles and tears that went into getting it to this point by a lot of people and I calls em as I sees em-sorry George-but I’m even more sorry for Kelly’s dad who has to live with seeing his son being tortured and murdered and hearing his last words as the breath was being sucked out of him as “I love you dad”

  • @Pate, no, I don’t wish for the deaths of family members of cops, I just refuse to feel sorry for the cop who looses his kid to other cops though i have the deepest of compassion for the kid himself.


    You haven’t been reading George too long if you think she’s a Sachs hating liberal.

    She does of course hate Goldman Sachs along with all other supporters of corporate statism regardless of political affiliation.

    Furthermore you’re an idiot because no one expect crime to disappear, we just want the policing model changed so that police have no more power than the rest of us to abuse people.

    In a truly free society, people would basically do their own policing and be able to protect themselves without limitation as long as they weren’t acting as aggressors.

    So keep licking those boots asswipes, maybe they won’t step on your throat quite as much.

  • George Sand

    @Merijoe – this post is not about blame. I did not say that Kelly Thomas’ father contributed to Kelly’s death. It’s about whether personal tragedy can open someones’ eyes to their own participation in a violent system. It’s about irony, and whether someone who previously lacked compassion for all others, can step away from that and see things through the perspective of others once they have suffered the tragedy that many others have suffered. I don’t believe this is such a horrible point to make. Many people come to the realization of how severe the police state is through instances such as this, whether they are cops or not. This situation is just particularly ironic and interesting because the victim’s father was a cop.

    @Pete – You are a great example of the failure of public schools. Where did I write that Kelly Thomas’ father should die? Where have I advocated that anyone should die? I have only characterized what Kelly Thomas’ father was made to suffer as an ironic TRAGEDY. I characterized it as an event that occurred in the “worst manner possible.” Learn to fucking read, moron. For someone who thinks I have failed at life, I really have my doubts as to your ability function in this world, given your borderline retarded reading capabilities.

  • merijoe

    No, George that is correct and I respect your opinion-
    My nerves are raw due to evil, mean spirted cop appologists and the various relatives of the murdering cops accusing Kelly’s dad of not being a good parent because Kelly was on the streets and not in his home (though Kelly was 37 and Schizophenic and keeping him against his will was not only illegal but impossible)and getting all pissy about the fact that Ron has a work history of unknown origins (like that makes a difference)

    I understand what you are saying and thank you for taking the time to explain it. Hey common sense, That’s compassion.

  • Brent Ryan Thornton

    Anyone who cannot see the irony here is blind. This deal reminds me of that deal happened up in wash st. I believe a cop left his kids in the fam minivan while he and his wife were scoring some painkillers. Alone, unattended with his service sidearm, his young son shot and killed his younger sister. In both these stories, the occupation of each father had a DIRECT relationship to the enabling circumstances as well as the ensuing media attention

  • Centurion

    @ Pete Lowlifes huh , than why do you reply to them if they disgust you so much. I know if something is disgusting, I tend to stay away from it. Im only saying this to you because Im in these blogs too ,trying to reestablish the publics power over Police. I hope you know your in the same boat as the people your insulting. All Depts. of cops are corrupt, every single one , including this one I hope they get the chair Cops disgust me.

  • Centurion

    @ sand, Dont worry about these little dweeb drama queens that think there educated because they can run their mouth like little bitches.Status has no meaning because this country was formed by poor farm boys. Degrees and Diplomas dont mean shit to freedom . I was a Naval Officer for 20 years and I hold 3 degrees 2 masters and 1 B.A. and it dont mean shit. Police bullshit does not discriminate . Weather your living in a shelter or Rodeo dr, in cali. their corruption stays the same. Their Bias,corrupt,conflicts of interest,violators of federal law,murderers lyers ,thieves, with extremely poor communication skills,bad integrity,poor responders, and a huge waste of our tax dollars, . This describes all Police they have committed treason against the constitution PERIOD and is punishable by death.

  • Centurion

    @ sand commonsense has NO IDEA WHAT HE IS TALKING ABOUT , dont respond to it. Very good article keep it up guys…..

  • Common Sense

    take your pill centy…go lie down for 20 minutes…

  • Common Sense


    you’re fucking stupid.

    You have never once been able to prove any of your dribbling(s). I would go into how you’re wrong, but why bother, I’ve know lots of silly fuckers in the past, they never listened to reason and I doubt you would. So, keep up the good fight you crazy fuck and remember “THE FLAG HAS A FRINGE!”

  • spirit of 46

    @George Sand. The statement by the American Public “well why did he disobey the officers?” is a sad case of how far this country has gotten from it’s beginning. Sadly the same people who say this would likely spit on the blood that was shed at America’s “Boston Massacre”

  • joe m

    this cop obviously feels horrible for what happened to his son at the hands of the police, however at least the justice system is investigating and charging those cops responsible for his sons death, can you imagine what it feels like to a regular civilian who loses his son who was murdered by police and because hes not a cop the officers responsible for the murder are not even punished that is the ultimate betrayal no closure, no charges, just lame excuses about how the victum was resisting and endangering the lives of the officers, there is definatley something wrong with our justice system in america and its only going to get worse

  • Marine andy

    I have to agree with everything George said about you. You make an assumption that the people who contribute to this websit have “failed at life” and blaim the police for that? I think that could be the ignorant statement of the year award. Most people I interact with in the cop block community are very successful. I own a thriving buisness and served honorably in the marine corps for 14 years. Law enforcement in this country is getting completely out of control. YouTube, and this website, are one of the few contributors to the proof of that statement. Look at this story, 6 complete shit birds beat a man to death, and for what? The biggest crime to a cop, contempt of cop. The problem also is more and more LE departments are allowing sociopaths among their ranks. Keep defending these scumbags in law enforcement you will be on the wrong side of things.

  • Hey

    Why is anyone replying or trying to reason with common (Cops can do not wrong) sense.

    Do you really believe he will be reasonable? ^^

  • Common Sense


    Please list where I have stated ‘cops can do no wrong’ –

  • @Common Sense.

    Leaving all the emotional arguements aside, couldn’t you just recognize that it is incidents like these over the course of some time that has cost the police forces trust? And, further, you must surely recognize that when trust is gone, that respect is sure to follow. When those two traits are gone, there is nothing but brute force that is left for the police to administer their appointed “jobs”. I argue that they are holding onto a hair-thin majority of a ratio of good officers to bad ones. Unless they get ahold of the bad ones in a very short order, and in a publicly demonstrative way, they will lose entirely the respect trait they still hold onto in the more rural, police friendly districts. Just my observations, no accustations or name-calling on my part.

  • The_Lakewood_4_are_burning_in_Hell

    Statistically speaking they do no wrong is your angle. If only a few hundred people get raped or murdered or beaten half to death by cops, it doesn’t matter given the number of contacts per year.

    Or something like that.

  • Jim

    Cops are civilians too.

  • Common Sense


    I will certainly agree with a majority of your comment.

    In the same breath, would you characterize the US Army, all of them, as potientinal rapists given the number for reported/estimated rapes (3100 for both 2010 and 2011, with estimations as high as 19000)? As it was reported, a member of the the US Army is more likely to be raped by a fellow soldier then anyone else.

    I feel the issue is perception. Had Lakewood’s daughter been raped by a service men, would his perception of the US Army change? One can assume. Had my family member been the victim of clearly an assault by the police, then perhaps mine would as well. But do you color the whole profession? How about doctors, 15000 malpractice suits per year, but are all doctors bad? The answer is no.

    Of course, you certainly punish those who break the law. No one here has of yet said otherwise. We are a system of laws and rules. Suspects, citizens, soldiers and cops, will have their day in court when they are charged.

    So, how do you thin out the sick and the weak? Most, if not all, have some type of annual performance review. Many cities have citizen review boards to investigate complaints of misconduct. I have yet to hear any cop poster here state that they were flat out opposed to being filmed or that misconduct doesn’t happen. Its just at the frequency is at issue.

    I think its a matter of shock value. Perhaps half the stories posted here are either misleading, hearsay, or flat out fabrications. Some are, obviously not. The ones that are factual need to be investigated obviously. Culpepper, NYPD, Trotwood, all those shootings are tragic, shocking events and must be cleared up via through investigations, either the cop was right or the cop was wrong. That’s the way, to my knowledge, police shooting are done. Kelly clearly shows misconduct from the outset, but, were the officers criminally negligent, did they have the intent to murder? That’s what the jury is for and it will be up to them to decide.

    Perhaps, as another poster commented, its all a matter of hiring and screening. Maybe it is. Maybe there needs to be not only annual training but also testing as well to document that officers are proficent in X,Y and Z. Maybe the pool of candidates isn’t that great. Like Culpepper, a town of just 16000. I don’t see too many growing up dreaming of carrying a gun in that town of 6 sq miles. So you get some local and then a homicide. Perhaps, had standards been higher, candidates might be better at decision making and conflict resolution. So, how does a small town like Culpepper attract those college grads from OWS who want 60k/yr? It does not make the profession appealing, so your forced to hire those with less then stellar backgrounds.

    For the most part, once you take out the typical rantings and babblings, I agree in general with many of the comments. The issue is how do you affect change? Filming won’t do it nor will the dozen or so cops arrested and charged with murder annually. Do you make the job more appealing with higher pay? Taxes will go up. Lower pay and you’ll get the boy behind the counter at McDonalds with a pistol, a shotgun and perhaps even an AR making decisons.

    So Alvin, I’ll ask you, with all bullshit aside. Considering there will always be corruption in every profession and career path, what’s the answer?

  • I don’t have all of the answers. I only have what everyone else has. My opinion based on my upbringing, my values of my surroundings, and the education imparted upon me. Using those, I feel that you are on to something there with the personnell quality. I would add better/longer training. I would suggest better public affairs presentations by the police when things go awry. Their tired and oft used excuses do not cut it anymore with the public. I am heartened to see that you at the least acknowledge that there is some corruption in the ranks. I think we percieve there to be more than there actually is. (Don’t jump down my throat folks). I think that the Unions, the cities & States that have hired, trained, and protect these corrupt LEOs are as much to blame for the current state of Citizen/Police relations. I even think that “We the People” share a good part of the blame in this breakdown. If we were the upstanding, moral, god-fearing folks we beat our chests over and crow about, we would not be here. If we, being these golden people, would vote out the corrupt politicians on the ballot instead of asking if they advance a political agenda, we would have better police forces. If we did not have the Unions protecting their own baliwicks at the expense of the common beat cops, this problem wouldn’t be as wide spread.
    Common, I have a lot of “where the problems are” just like everyone else. What I don’t offer is an iron-clad solution. That is something Waaaaaaay above my pay-grade.

  • Centurion

    I told you all Common is a trailor trash divorced cop, when you reply to his pez dispencing, he will write a novel, making himself feel good so his self esteem on his uneducated lowlife mind will self satisfy.He needs to go to Concord State Hospital and get checked out. He mentions downsyndrome and mental illness all the time. Maybe its his mind trying to tell him that he needs some love from some really huge nurses over there in concord. Or he can travel to Loudon find me and I can put him under citizens arrest for treason, disability discrimination,officer unbecoming, maybe smack him in the face with a huge thing of pork loin just for being one of the biggest sketchball dushbags on this blog.

  • Centurion

    @ Alvin, I really respect your perception of whats going on , but I disagree with one thing. Its not the Unions,politics is years of overlooking how many regulations and laws that have been passed that actually violate the law. Our Grandparents, great or great great, should have stopped this a long time ago. Now here we are in our living rooms where theres not one thing NOT being regulated. Police have a false sense of what there real duty is . I will tell you , its taking orders from us, serving us, confiding in us, relying on us the GENERAL public. By Federal Law , Police have no power unless we say they do PERIOD.

  • How do you affect change? That is a very good question. I was asked that question from a school teacher in Ukraine last year just before their election. They were forced with much the same choice for leadership as we were. They had two equally unappealing candidates before them from either side of the political spectrum. They had been disappointed in the Orange Revolution from ’04, and were disallusioned about the reforms promised and failed. I Told this teacher when she asked me this question simply this.

    Change begins with us. We make the decision to be who we are or become. We hold ourselves and those we hold close to a certain standard. We teach others around us what we learn. We learn from others whom we respect. We use our education and relegion as yardsticks to determine what is right/wrong. We fervently support those causes that fit in our determinations, and fight equally hard against those that do not. We remain gracious towards others in our support, and civil towards others in our opposition. We, in short, by one individual at a time, and modifying ourselves as we travel in life, make the change as we live.

    She was very appreciative of my view. I hope this helps someone here as well. (However, I know there will be at least one who will post that this is a defeatist stance.)

  • @Centurion,

    I can agree somewhat with that statement. Although, I am not as ardent against the police as you. Yes, the laws written & passed are the heart of the problem. Just crack open the code book and be overwhelmed at the confusion and contadiction. It still stems to the fact that the boomer generation in all of their flower-child fervor demanded “There ought to be a law” and we allowed them to elect, write, and pass those offronts to our constitution.

    People are near fed up with this latest leftest push on us. They want things changed, and they want them changed now. The problem is that for us to return to the same opportunities that our grandparents enjoyed will take much longer to get there than the vast majority realises.

  • Centurion

    Notice to all Cops, when you get sworn in , knowing you will be infringing on every ones right to free travel, breaking federal law by impeding the jurisdiction of the public , violating the constitution by treason when you openly ticket your bosses by fallowing false laws, hidden by city ordinances, violating federal law by participating in check points , doing illegal search and take overs, violating the publics jurisdiction by stopping them for I.Ds., doing favors for friends family and coworkers by abusing our equipment resources,violating your own false traffic laws , think of me I am Centurion I will band citizens together to stop you , punish you, and we will prosecute you for treason.

  • Centurion

    @ Alvin, True that, true that.

  • Centurion

    I agree it will take some time but my faith in freedom and liberty hopefully , there will be a quick response from people like yourself and others to rise up for real change to establish the constitution again.

  • Common Sense


    When I spoke of mental illness, I spoke of the nonsense you babble about.

    Perhaps your sovreign ideals would be best suited to Canada. Well, not they don’t work there either. I’ll wait to hear how you sued police department X for 6 million in silver.

  • Common Sense


    Again, I agree with a majority of your comment(s).

    Sadly, a majority of people do not know how to affect change nor do they know how things actually function.

  • The_Lakewood_4_are_burning_in_Hell

    They fail to function, they collapse. Sometimes it gets better, sometimes they don’t. The Soviet Union was just as corrupt and disfunctional as the US is now. It collapsed, from rot and war and a failed ideology (sound familiar). It is back as Neosoviet Empire II. Same players, same ideology, different titles.

    Writing your congressman won’t do a fucking thing. Voting out Obama for Romney, or keeping Obama, or writing in Zombie Reagan won’t change anything. But what will bring change is when we finally run out of money to feed the beast and it’s miriad enforcers in blue and robes. When that happens, bury your uniform. it will not be pleasant if the experiences of the Stasi are any indication.

    I cannot wait until it all falls apart.

  • The_Lakewood_4_are_burning_in_Hell

    And as a side note, Ms. Sand is pretty easy on the eyes. I hadn’t taken a look at the contributor’s pictures until today. Glad I did.

  • Centurion

    @common shut up 5 year old trash, @Alvin the problem is not how to affect change , the problem is it never should of changed. We need to back peddle and undo all the socialistic bullshit politics and idiots like common and t put in place the past 55 years to shit on THE REAL LAW of the land and thats us.Its easy to trash people that dislike police but Police are illegal. what they do ,how they carry themselves, how they make arrests, how the drive ETC ETC ETC. The list will go on forever, bottom line ITS TREASON against the UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION. Cops make a vow to protect and serve the weak and vow to uphold the constitution but they shit on it by enforcing laws while violating the federal law. Cops are weak minded and poorly educated most of them became cops because the economy and its just a sure job. Others become cops because they have been bullied in school and revenge to life is on there mind. Most became cops for the status of power, whatever the motivation is it is NEVER an INTEGRAL,non bias,impartial,decent reason and thats the fuckin truth of it. @ common your right , if i could I would sue every fuckin one of you to the chair or firing squad for treason against the UNION and slap you in the face with pork loin just because.

  • Vern

    Just looking at the mugshots of Ramos and Cicinelli with their bloated pumpkin heads as well as their psychotic thirst for violence and it is clear they are very likely abusing steroids, same goes for their fellow officers who assisted in the savage torture murder of Kelly Thomas

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